Why did you remove the link or whatever was here. Now this thread is worthless. Might as well delete it.
Mind blown, jaw dropped
- Thread starter Vaskadar
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Why did you remove the link or whatever was here. Now this thread is worthless. Might as well delete it.
It's kind of counter intuitive at first, but when you think about it, it makes sense. A picture can also consist of more pixels than actual bits, provided it's compressed correctly.
![[GU]elmur_fud](/data/avatars/s/47/47919.jpg?1425583194){kind=avatar}
[GU]elmur_fud
I have balls of Depleted Uranium
yeah, wtf Vaskadar? Did you wuss out by the opposition, or do you know something we don't?
It's not just shady - they managed to pull a $2 million government research grant for their demo last year, and this is all they have to show for it (they created a new scene out of their existing assets).
If you guys missed the HardOCP video you should give it a look. I think it answers almost ever major question I saw in this thread, and it's pretty conclusive proof that the thing is for real. They also mention that it will be a while before we hear from them again.
[M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVB1ayT6Fdc[/M]
[M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVB1ayT6Fdc[/M]
That video made me doubt them even more because it's basically a straight up lie since they baited us in by calling this proof, and then just repeated what we've seen before with no proof of their claims.
That guy basically set up a bunch of strawmen with those other engines. He keeps saying unlimited detail, but I've just seen the same objects repeating infinitely, which IS what has been possible before with voxel technology. Everything that was in that "real-time demo" is known to be possible. We need a real-time demo of non-repeating objects and also the animation.
That guy basically set up a bunch of strawmen with those other engines. He keeps saying unlimited detail, but I've just seen the same objects repeating infinitely, which IS what has been possible before with voxel technology. Everything that was in that "real-time demo" is known to be possible. We need a real-time demo of non-repeating objects and also the animation.
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Still no lighting, animation or any kind of simple physics. Still the same tiled, unrotated content used ad-infinatum. Move along, nothing to see here.
Edit: Real-deal hybrid tech engine that doesn't suck and isn't snake oil:
http://www.youtube.com/user/AtomontageEngine
Edit: Real-deal hybrid tech engine that doesn't suck and isn't snake oil:
http://www.youtube.com/user/AtomontageEngine
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There are fundamental weaknesses to this tech which they simply avoid talking about.
One is memory consumption, he tells us it isn't an issue, but look at the world.
it's essentially instanced copies of the same thing over and over. So the only way he's dodging the memory consumption hit is by taking the old fashion approach of modularising the environment into repeatable textures and meshes.
Another weakness is that while it might be fairly easy to render complex stuff, it is just as taxing memory wise to render a cube as it is to render that elephant statue. With polygons you just need to store 8 vertices and some additional info. Then you apply a cheap 2d texture to it. costs next to no memory compared to this method.
A third one is undersampling. Notice they keep telling us how amazing it looks, but at some point in the video you see them getting up close and it looks like a pixelated mess. In traditional polygon rendering that's easily solved by using bilinear filtering and multitexturing, but when you go volumetric it becomes tricky. You can start introducing procedural filtering as a compromise, but that's one of those areas that looks good on paper but is tricky to get to work decently in a production pipeline.
A possible workaround would be to use point clouds for rendering and polygons and textures for storage, so voxelising the scene at runtime, and guess what polygon engines are slowly starting to make use off...
On a final note, people wouldn't be so critical if this Bruce Dell guy wasn't such an ass. He takes worst case scenarios of games that look infinite times better than his own, and breaks them apart over geometry density. He doesn't share any technical info whatsoever about his amazing discovery.
Which not only leads to believe he's a snakeoil salesman, but it's bad sportsmanship when compared to the graphics industry that shares plenty of their technological breakthroughs with the industry at large. And he doesn't prove anything at all in that video. It's a low res screengrab with absolutely nothing of value about how the system works internally, ridden with marketing speech. Compare this guy's attitude to a John Carmack who open sourced all of his engines at some point. In my opinion this guy is getting all the flak he deserves.
One is memory consumption, he tells us it isn't an issue, but look at the world.
it's essentially instanced copies of the same thing over and over. So the only way he's dodging the memory consumption hit is by taking the old fashion approach of modularising the environment into repeatable textures and meshes.
Another weakness is that while it might be fairly easy to render complex stuff, it is just as taxing memory wise to render a cube as it is to render that elephant statue. With polygons you just need to store 8 vertices and some additional info. Then you apply a cheap 2d texture to it. costs next to no memory compared to this method.
A third one is undersampling. Notice they keep telling us how amazing it looks, but at some point in the video you see them getting up close and it looks like a pixelated mess. In traditional polygon rendering that's easily solved by using bilinear filtering and multitexturing, but when you go volumetric it becomes tricky. You can start introducing procedural filtering as a compromise, but that's one of those areas that looks good on paper but is tricky to get to work decently in a production pipeline.
A possible workaround would be to use point clouds for rendering and polygons and textures for storage, so voxelising the scene at runtime, and guess what polygon engines are slowly starting to make use off...
On a final note, people wouldn't be so critical if this Bruce Dell guy wasn't such an ass. He takes worst case scenarios of games that look infinite times better than his own, and breaks them apart over geometry density. He doesn't share any technical info whatsoever about his amazing discovery.
Which not only leads to believe he's a snakeoil salesman, but it's bad sportsmanship when compared to the graphics industry that shares plenty of their technological breakthroughs with the industry at large. And he doesn't prove anything at all in that video. It's a low res screengrab with absolutely nothing of value about how the system works internally, ridden with marketing speech. Compare this guy's attitude to a John Carmack who open sourced all of his engines at some point. In my opinion this guy is getting all the flak he deserves.
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I don't think you know what an API is.
Also this is like the 4th thread we've had about this and I'll say in this one what I said in the last one: This technology is ancient. This is not infinite detail, that is impossible. Just because a tech demo looks cool does not mean it has any application in games.
The frak is up with this bump?
'Infinity' was always commercial BS coated with a thin paste of voxel tech. Nothing more to see here.
'Infinity' was always commercial BS coated with a thin paste of voxel tech. Nothing more to see here.
This debate is silly. They are claiming 'unlimited', yet as we know from anything in computer science to physics to economics, nothing can be 'unlimited' or 'free'. Memory has to be stored somewhere, so unless you have infinite ram, your not going to get unlimited detail.
This simple fact that the title is exaggerated and false leaves me to not trust anything else they have to say.
This simple fact that the title is exaggerated and false leaves me to not trust anything else they have to say.