What features do you most want to see in INF

geo; I think that a more simpler and more technically viable option would be to change the default FOV (or lock it) to say 110, 120 degrees. Unfortunately, the fisheye effect on a monitor looks odd and would probably turn off some people, and as has been discussed many times before, accurately simulating proper 3D depth on a flat screen is pretty much impossible.

well you see. That's the problem. Along the center, the spatial resolution should give you around 45° and along the edges no 180°, but close.

yurch said:

I don't think the injury system really has a damn thing to do with it. Consider everything a one-hit-kill and remove that factor from the equation entirely.

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The injury-system wouldn't force limitations on the MG's, but it would give some advantages to the rifles.
Imagine a system where a single-shot could create a shock that makes you impossible to fight firther like nothing happen right after few seconds after the hit.
I don't speak about 'one shot one kill', because when the shock is over you could still fight, with less effeciancy but you still could.

Look at games like like AA:O, the SAW is the best CQB weapon (if you are not a total skilled ass with the M4A1... which means low ping).
Any why is it so? Because you need more shots to kill and a single shot has no real stunning/shocking effect, so you really need to fire more rounds to make the enemy not dangerous to yourself.
And since the SAW fires more rounds and I think faster too, it is superior.


Another thing that I was discussing with gal-z in other threads is, that MG's, even if a lightweight SAW, can't be held for to long at the shoulder and a tired arm won't control recoil good enough. The MG's would be held more at a hipped (sideways) positions and could be fired from hip, having a larger freeaim-area.
So you shoot from hip les accurate, or take in count a short delay when you lift it to the shoulder first.
And taking a sideways held MG to the shoulder takes more time than taking a light rifle, which has the buttstock allready at the shoulder, from low-ready (yes geo ) to high-ready.

They are all the small details that can be called 'natural balance'. An MG will always be superior in firepower, but the real-life physics/characteristics are always present and define things.

They might be even more details to consider I don't think about right now.

Crowze said:

I'd like a decent way of simulating peripheral view.

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I always thought about that and thought about making the view 16:9 with the black strips at the top and bottom (like watching a 16:9 movie on a 9:6 TV).
The good thing would be, that you have a panoramic view and you could place the HUD elements outside the view into the balck area (could be problematic with real 16:9 monitors).
The bad thing is, that it makes the objects you see smaller, which is not nice.


A fish-eye view would be horrible, except you are an ALIEN.

I was thinking along the same lines, but maybe having it more dynamic like AimView. For example, your normal view is your 16:9 widescreen - maybe with geo's spherical FOV, but when you are moving slowly, stopped or aiming then your view will smoothly switch to 4:3 ('focus').

You never know, it might work.

Hehe, this is the sort of thing I thought about when I palyed BF2-demo. The aim has the slight zoom in and I noticed that I often aimed just to check out the distant areas.
This made me think of a zoom-in feature (like Q3, but not that extreme), where you would have a wider view for CQB and whereever it is needed, and a slightly zoomed-in view for checking out the distance (when proning and observing, or just observing).
Aimed weapons would not have the zoom-in automatical, because when you just need to aim in CQB the lose of peripheral view would be bad and especially when you have binocular aimed reflex sights, which you can aim and travel around in CQB as in real-life. For distant shots you could use the zoom-in.

the problem is of course that it might suck to switch between the two zoom's. Ok when you need to aim on distance instantly, the 'aim-key hold' feature could have an automatical zoom (push=aim+no zoom, hold=aim+zoom).

Psychomorph said:

long unrelated headache about machinegun balance

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You do realize I wanted machineguns to be more powerful on the greater scope, right?

yurch said:

You do realize I wanted machineguns to be more powerful on the greater scope, right?

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I realize INF's SAW needs it.

geogob said:

well you see. That's the problem. Along the center, the spatial resolution should give you around 45° and along the edges no 180°, but close.

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I remember making a post along these lines waaay back, and posted a mock up of what I was talking about. At the center, the angle was about 40° and at the edge, I made it around 160°. I just took screenshots at the various FOVs, and pasted them together in photoshop to give a rough idea.

I'd think one would want to set it up so that as you get farther from the center, the change in FOV increases in the form of a parabola.

The other problem comes from the corners of the screen. There's 3 ways that I can think of to deal with this:
1st, the edge of the screen is always 160
2nd, the corners are the farthest point from the center, and thus they should be 160, and he edges are scaled based on that distance.
3rd, The horizontal edges of the screen are farthest, set those to 160. Trim the corners to form an ellipse, and scale the edge of the ellipse accordingly. The corners are black.

I'd probably go with the third option and place any HUD info in the black corners.

I've always wished having only a knife would dramatically increase my speed in general. Hell, if it did, I would seriously attempt ninja strikes.

It was done this way not to encourage rushing (instead move as a team) and to take into account that a soldier would need to carry lots of basic gear that forbid to run like a sprinter.

well the reason for ppl are rushing is that stamina doesnt affect aim anything only the hold breath and some wounds affect the aiming and jogging and go to crouch is almost instant is also why ppl go solo and rush ,if these things were changed ppl would not rush as much...but then again how fun would that make the game if everyone is forced doing the same thing everytime all over n over.

Hi. I discovered Infiltration only some weeks ago, and am already a big fan It's the
first game that has intressted me since the original UT. I've been lurking this forum a bit, and figured I'd add my two cents.

About the peripheral vision: I know this doesn't exactly go for visual realism, but it would probably be very easy to implement (as in more-likely-to-happen):

If something moves in your peripheral vision field, a human brain allmost always notices that *something* is moving. Why not simulate this by putting a marker on the screen that points in the direction of the moving object. It should be very coarse, like only a right or left arrow, and maybe "big object" and "small object". Then you would have to turn to see what it really is, but then this is the case in real life too.

Preferably there should be some 'false alerts' randomness to it, to make it more realistic. Also, you could have name indication for your teammates, as in real life you would recognize them from their movement patterns.

If nothing else, couldn't this be a substitute solution while waiting for the fisheye system to be implemented? (Personally, I think fisheye is not such a great idea because I sure would get nausea withing minutes!)

I would also like to see a feature that enabled you to hold your gun out around a corner and shoot covering fire, with very poor aiming of course.

Another thing would be a switch for the grenades so you could activate them without immediately throwing them. (Like, first press on primary fire activates the grenade, second press works like normal)

...awaiting the flames...

Janoch said:

I would also like to see a feature that enabled you to hold your gun out around a corner and shoot covering fire, with very poor aiming of course.

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That would be hard to add to the game since it requires extremely good hit detection. You also need game rules covering what happens when bullets hit a players weapon (hopefully not like RO's system bleh). It also adds very little to gameplay, most soldiers are taught to never use unaimed fire so you'd only see an insurgent doing that.

If there are insurgents in the game tho.... then that would be a nice feature. Many of the religious fanatics like to spray bullets around corners like that. 1) They know if they expose themselves they won't last long against the marksmenship of US soldiers. 2) They rely on Allah to guide the bullets into the infidel .

Another thing would be a switch for the grenades so you could activate them without immediately throwing them. (Like, first press on primary fire activates the grenade, second press works like normal)

...awaiting the flames...

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I have a strong suspicion you need to RTFM . Otherwise, you're going to have to clarify why you mean by "activate them." The INF soldier doesn't immediately throw the nade, just keep primary fire held down until you want to release the throw. It will only explode in your hand if using alt fire since the soldier releases the spoon when alt fire is pressed.

keihaswarrior said:

That would be hard to add to the game since it requires extremely good hit detection. You also need game rules covering what happens when bullets hit a players weapon (hopefully not like RO's system bleh). It also adds very little to gameplay, most soldiers are taught to never use unaimed fire so you'd only see an insurgent doing that.

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Yup. I'm not too experienced with Inf yet (still haven't played online, for instance...) so I haven't started seeing all the bugs/bad hit detection problems people talk about. But wouldn't you take cover if somebody started to shoot like this, even if you knew their hit probability was poor?

1) They (insurgents) know if they expose themselves they won't last long against the marksmenship of US soldiers.

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Guess who doesn't last long against the marksmenship of bots on Private skill setting

Anyway, would it be any harder than a new player skin to add insurgents and other uhr, "civilians" to the game?

I have a strong suspicion you need to RTFM .

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Oops, your so correct! Still, I don't find it in the manual. Wierd thing I didn't figure this one out already though...

BTW, I'm not exactly up to speed on the discussions here; are vehicles totally out of question in the UT99 engine? Even with insane coding skillz? Not even one of them neato attack rafts or whatever they're called?

Janoch said:

Guess who doesn't last long against the marksmenship of bots on Private skill setting

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Heres a hint: Bots can't see you when leaning. Just take cover, lean out and it's a turkey shoot. Also, the bot difficulty varies tremendously with the weapon they use. IMT weapons and the PSG1 make the bot somewhat lethal . A bot with an MP5 on Private setting can't kill you from 10m away.

Anyway, would it be any harder than a new player skin to add insurgents and other uhr, "civilians" to the game?

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Look at the screenshot I posted. There are a lot of custom camos to go DL for INF.

Oops, your so correct! Still, I don't find it in the manual. Wierd thing I didn't figure this one out already though...

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Another thing newbs don't often figure out is how to steady their aim. Hold down alt-fire to do so. I especially recommend this when using a scope (but in general scopes are clumsy and useless anyway )

BTW, I'm not exactly up to speed on the discussions here; are vehicles totally out of question in the UT99 engine? Even with insane coding skillz? Not even one of them neato attack rafts or whatever they're called?

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It is basically impossible to have a good playable, player controlled vehicle that isn't super buggy. Efforts have been made with movers to simulate vehicles. Check out EAS-LondonCityFix4 to ride in a Blackhawk and check out DM-Cymru to ride in a Zodiac boat.

keihaswarrior said:

Just take cover, lean out and it's a turkey shoot. Also, the bot difficulty varies tremendously with the weapon they use. IMT weapons and the PSG1 make the bot somewhat lethal. A bot with an MP5 on Private setting can't kill you from 10m away.

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Argh, now you've ruined bot play for me! And I'm pretty sure I suck way too much on FPS:es to play with anybody playing Inf nowadays since it's such an old mod. Only über-1337 veterans playing these days, right?

Another thing (snip) is how to steady their aim. (snip) (but in general scopes are clumsy and useless anyway )

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That one I figured. However, the only weapon I manage to be somewhat proficent with is the MP5, and that's only because it has that red point sight so I have *some* clue as to where I'm aiming. That does indicate I pretty much suck, doesn't it?

It is basically impossible to have a good vehicle

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Crap. I'm reading up on UT-script (I am an old C/C++/asm geezer) but it seems quite messy. Is UnrealWiki the best info source?

Anyway, this thread was supposed to be about peripheral vision !

I say in game vision stays like it it, but implement a glance key that when held, you move the mouse left/right and the view turns in the wanted direction, but in a more downwards direction. People don't look around with their heads like owls do.

Has anyone ever played Vietcong? You crouch and stay still any you are almost sitting on the ground. move in a direction and you get up a little bit to move. Same applies to aiming (ironsights). You aim and you get up a bit. Helpful when you're hiding behind low cover - you get up a bit to aim over the object. Kinda like Psychomorph's suggestions. Kinda

My vision:
-Keep it an infantry based game
-Add minimum but realistic looking vehicle support for only certain maps
-Realistic hit-boxes, more detailed than the player models, including heart, lungs and bones
-Enhanced realistic bullet penetration
-Surprise us, Sentry Studios

changing teams. I.e. in one map, it's government military versus mercenaries, in another, it's american versus iraqi forces, country versus country, just generally diferent maps, and completely, believable stories with them. I don't want another desert combat like game where the good guys/bad guys are american/iraqi all the time. I also want to know who i am, and who i'm fighting, too...