...and then there is the Shock Rifle.

Has anyone heard as to what they, the 'Envy' game developers, have in mind for the most popular weapon in the UT series (my opinion; I'm not going to refute anyone else's). For me, one of the most rewarding experiences while learning how to play ut2k4 was becoming efficient in executing shock combos while moving at the same time. I then learned how to fire two shock balls and then shoot a beam into both of them in that exact sequence, while moving around at the same time. This takes a lot of effort and concentration to do. It is a rewarding experience everytime I do this, even when playing around offline.

I hope they keep the abilty to use your hand-eye coordination and spacial awareness to the same advanced level you are able to in ut2k4. The thing that keeps me into ut2k4 is the learning curve; there are so many different things you can learn to whore; loads of specialty jumps on every map and there are so many different variations in the way you can do things; you go through epiphanies that improve your game and give you the ability to do things that you couldn't do before (ex: learning how to time the dodge jump correctly, which opens the door to a lot of new jumps on different maps.)

So what experiences have you all had with the shock rifles from different games in the ut series? What aspects of the shock rifle did you love and what things would you like to see integrated into the next game?

One thing I dislike about the shock rifle in ut2k4 is the shock balls. I think they deal out too much damage. I think it would better if you didn't feel the need to move out of the way of a shock ball because of the outrageous 40 damage it deals to you, but because of the shock rifle user's competence in hitting shock combos and to stop getting my shot from being absorbed into it. People don't use the shock for alt fire so why add in an extra bonus for failed shock combos? But what is done is done.

I know the new shock rifle is going to be entirely different and innovated which is great, but I just hope they keep the same elements in that make shock rifle such a fun weapon for more advanced players. Make it so it is hard to use the weapons in a certain way, but if you can use it in that way, you get a slight advantage to other players that haven't yet learned to use the weapon in that more advanced way. Give us something to make a frag vid about.

I'd actually prefer the secondary shock to not interact with the environment, but instead only be a ghost ball that drifts though things and people(not walls) till someone detonates it with primary shock. Or atleast make it do less than 40 damage. It might as well not even do any damage because of all the other beneficial properties it has. Blocking incoming fire, 40 damage, and a potential shock combo is too much.

Shock is very effective against floaty and light vehicles. The most effective weapons are prim flak and prim shock, making other weapons pointless in ONS. One thing they'll have to change in the next UT is the balance between foot soldiers and vehicles. The only use for most floaty vehicles is the extra armor and the fast speed and vehicles being easy to hit with hitscan doesn't anger me because if I couldn't defend myself against a flimsy vehicle then what would be the purpose of not operating a vehicle? What is even more silly is when people run straight at you and don't except to get hit with 100% accuracy

The only reason I don't hit vehicles 100% percent with a hitscan weapon is because of the crappy choppy fps I get during ONS maps. And shock primary devastates floaty vehicles like raptor, manta, cicada, and the scorpion, no other weapon is as effective as shock primary except flak primary which can only be used in close range. I wouldn't touch the AVRIL if I didn't get such crappy fps. But the hardest part in making a game is trying to keep the weapons balanced in every skill level. In lower levels, players can't hit vehicles with shock consistently and they don't have good aim. It would pretty silly to expect the weapons to be balanced in a wide open level when hitscan will own regardless of how well they balanced the weapons.

One thing I'd hate to see is the game makers changing shock rifle to suit vehicle combat more than what ut series is well known for, which would be CTF and TDM. Maybe they should make maps that appeal to different people. Like make a map for novices and make a map for people that have good aim and prediction skills. Don't include shock rifle in a wide open map if people like getting road rage kills and such. But most people that complain about shock hitscan are the ones that don't understand the "don't run straight at your opponent" aspect of ut2k4. Use the map to your advantage. Swoop down with rockets. Time it so right when your opponent walks around a corner he gets a bunch of link prim in his face. It isn't about running in a straight line to your opponent, whenever you see him.

Hitscan skill should still be rewarded, but instead of trying to nerf hitscan weapons to make more balanced play in large levels maybe they should get rid of the hitscan weapon pickups in large levels. Vehicles all have their uses. Scorpion manta and raptor are used for getting around to an advantageous location quickly. Tanks are made to be badass and effective in holding a locations if supported by foot soldiers that hitscan raptors and fast moving vehicles, but they are slow getting around. The goliath with it's hitscan splash fire can hold a pathway very effectively but it's slow turret makes it less effective against fast vehicles that have already breached the field of fire that tank dominates, into a closer proximity, while the paladin uses it's shield to hold an area against fire from long distances while also keeping vehicles and players from getting in close proximity by the centralized shock wave feature you can use by having shield up and firing into the shield. The Cicada brings a real cool concept in with the indirect fire and fast z axis movement. Leviathan is just a badass vehicle. If mantas and raptors could get to a location fast and also have the ability to hold it's own against skilled foot soldiers it would be imbalanced. Mantas and fast vehicles should not have more armor or be more damaging, they suit their purpose. And hitscan should always be effective in a large map made for hitscan. If you want a map where vehicles easily mash through foot soldiers then get rid of hitscan in that map.

I dislike stand still combos. I wouldn't want to have stand still combos anymore effective than they are right now.
I think a less damaging shock primary fire would be better in my opinion, becuase without it's rof it would be too similar to sniper. And I think the thing pissing most people off is the shock balls absorbing everything.

I don't think doing combos while standing still should be as rewarding as it is right now. Non-absorbing shock balls would have made it so standing shock comboers would be a lot easier to defend against. One logical reason why the shock prim does 45 damage with the rof it has is because it is much harder to hit 3 shots in a row on someone with that rof. The lg yields higher percentages because you don't have to continuously keep your mouse on the person, but I think the knock back of primary on shock might make it more easier to hit someone with multiple shots in quick succession, plus having a hitscan weapon capable of dishing out more damage per second than the lightning gun (which is only hitscan), shock combo, and fire splash damage projectile that absorb everything all in on weapon is way to overpowered. I think the shock prim would be ok with it's rof if it did 35 damage.

-AEnubis- said:

I dont' think anything hit-scan should have that ROF. I also think it's similarity to the sniper rifle shouldn't be an issue, because it should as well have an decreased ROF... the point of shock in no way shape or form should be about the beam. With a higher ROF, and same damage, you wouldn't want to pull it for the beam, because it's not effective. That would put more focus on the gun for it's versitility, and not because of any one aspect it has that is too proficient.

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I'd have that gun out more than any other gun if I cared about the score and didn't find hitscan boring. 45 damage and increased rate of fire with momentum, that would be wickedly effective. You practically could push people backwards with that thing.

If you pulled the Shock Rifle for any one reason before, it was for the combo. Now, it depends too much on the situation, and it's effective in too many situatons.

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Yes I agree. I think they should reduce the effectiveness of the shockrifle's hitscan. The only problem is there needing to be another effective hitscan weapon that adds variety to the game, because having one effective hitscan weapon (sniper if shock is nerfed) when hitscan rules the game would make the game boring. But there is only so much they can do to the balance the game. Hitscan will always rule in the more skilled matches, unless the hitscan is nerfed to the point where it is never effective in medium skilled matches.

It seems UT's shock combo was a stand still weapon. Being able to hit mutiple combos in quick succession or firing a combo then dodgin off a wall and hitting the combo is a lot cooler than standing combos. It's like air rox compared to shooting at someone's feet with rockets.

I hope the next shock rifle, regardless of rof or damage, can be used in many different artful ways. I enjoy dodging and moving around while hitting shock combos. It takes practice and a good connection but it adds a lot of depth to the game.