UE1 - UT UnrealServer may be capable of running more than one level simultaneously?

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VBKesha

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Jan 17, 2013
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I learn UnrealScript, and in the process discovered an interesting moment for me.
But English is not my native language and I'm afraid that has mistake understood the part of text.
UnrealScript Language Reference: Last Updated: 12/21/98 said:
All gameplay takes place inside a "level", a self-contained environment containing geometry and actors. Though UnrealServer may be capable of running more than one level simultaneously, each level operates independently, and are shielded from each other: actors cannot travel between levels, and actors on one level cannot communicate with actors on another level.
How to correctly understand
1. The server can run on a simulation of multiple levels (maps) simultaneously
2. The server can store multiple levels (maps) at a time, and it can switch between them, but do not simultaneously
 

Wormbo

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Jun 4, 2001
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Unreal Engine 1 and 2 support only one gameplay level and one "entry" level per instance. The entry level doesn't exist on dedicated servers, IIRC.

There is no way to load other levels. The entry level is specified in the INI file and can't be changed at runtime (it provides a place to store stuff that should persist between levels), while the gameplay level can be switched with various console commands. The closest thing to what the UScript reference describes there are the ?push and ?pop URL options. With ?push you tell the game to save the current state before loading the new map and with ?pop you restore the saved game after unloading the current map. That works multiple levels deep, but essentially only is a trick to create the illusion of multiple active levels.
 

dr.flay

Dr.Flay™
Sep 19, 2011
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You would need purpose built maps, running on a "ring" of servers.
I was thinking of this system for playing UT with Stargate maps, but it requires a server for each map, so would require too much resources.
 

DeusIX

Engineer
Mar 22, 2009
168
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Winland
I actually did something like this with .:..:'s U1toUT2 mappack.

I edited (few of) the maps so that they'd teleport into another server. In my case the servers IP stays the same, but the port changes. and Since UT2 idles really well I could run multiple UT2 setups :)

But then you know ... work and other stuff distracted and I never announced or finished my project.

My plans included to edit the servers so that they'd run invasion and the monsters that'd spawn woul be only those that you'd find on the U1 levels. .:..:'s UT2 maps do have the monsters, but utstatsdb doesn't get any statistics from those, so I can't have them in the public games.
 

MrLoathsome

New Member
Apr 1, 2010
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I am sure this* can happen, but haven't looked into it close enough to tell anybody
how to make it work correctly.....

*Not portals to other servers, but 1 instance of UT running more than 1 level.

Several months ago, I was messing with rewriting some of the default gametypes,
attempting to add a few features and correct issues with U1 monsters in UT games
etc.

Was also implementing support for playing TDM or DOM on any maptype.
i.e. DM/DOM/CTF maps.


Something very very odd happened when I was testing my changes and attempted
to use the default RocketArena maps for DM or DOM. Very very very odd.

Setup a game with 4 or 6 bots, DM on a RA map.

The RA map would load up fine, but only 2 of the players or bots would be on the
RA map. But I could hear the other bots shooting and doing the various taunts
although they were nowhere to be seen....

Then I got killed, and was respawned on DM-Landri, where all the missing bots were happily engaged in a match on that map. And I could hear
the shots/taunts from the bots that were then on the RA map.

Got killed again, and respawned back in the RA map......:eek:

This happened several times. Sometimes I would respawn in a DM
match on the RA map with just 1 bot, and others I would spawn on
DM-Landri with the rest of them....

At the time, this result was not at all what I was hoping for, and sort of
freaked me out. Without a doubt the oddest thing I have seen in UT at
any point since it was released.

Scoring etc was sorta all screwed up, as my alpha gametype code had not
anticipated this at all. At that point I just bailed out on supporting the
RA maps for DM or DOM games....

I even made a note at the time to look into that further, to see if a
gametype could be made that had 2 maps running at the same time
adding a portal or 3 to the maps so players/bots could jump from one
map to the other. Never looked at it since then, but it is still on the list.

There was no doubt that the UT engine was running 2 separate maps
simultaneously. One instance of UT on 1 PC...

The answer as to why this happened, is buried in the RA maps themselves.
(I think....)

There might also be clues in the RocketArena gametype code, but I was not
using any of that in my alpha gametype when this occurred.
The alpha gametype was just extending DeathMatchPlus, and attempting to run TDM
on a RA map.

Haven't posted here in quite a while, but this thread reminded me of that
experience. Thought I would share those observations as they seem
relevant.

If anybody else can use this info to make progress on this, go for it.
I will scratch that off my list. The list grows faster than I can work
on it... :rolleyes:
 
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Wises

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Sep 15, 2008
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sounds interesting.. i can see where things will get sticky at least... meaning the sound side of things.. unless theres some way perhaps of splitting the [galaxy.sounddriver] between both/all instances?.. maybe even go so far as to have sep .ini's for each individual game.. with different settings. or some thing.. be kinda unique to say the least.

..interesting.
 

MrLoathsome

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Apr 1, 2010
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UT Server is capable of running multi levels

Well sound is not even an issue. I don't think...

But check this out:

484128024.jpg


778451948.jpg


962104573.jpg


There are bots on those various maps all playing 1 game of deathmatch
on 6 levels.

I think I did something, but not sure what....

See attached.
:D
 

Attachments

  • MultiLevelUT99_AlphaTest1.zip
    401.6 KB · Views: 5

dr.flay

Dr.Flay™
Sep 19, 2011
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This is what I said somewhere in the past about RA maps.
Essentially it is just running disconnected mini sub-levels, within the 1 map.
I never got my head around playing it and how to jump from level to level (other than die).

Good use of portals and teleports could allow navigating these maps easier.
 

Wises

New Member
Sep 15, 2008
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cool alright.. what i think we are trying to achieve is have 6 individual matches all running concurrently?

as this stands .. presumably.. there are 36 bots all playing 1 game of dm? and spawning in different levels.. about the space?.. like dying in first level respawning in second and or randomly.. into which ever world... space the engine desires?..
 

MrLoathsome

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Apr 1, 2010
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That pretty much sums it up Wises. Although have only been testing with 16 bots
so far.

In further testing today, it turns out that my Random Spawn Locations mutator
seems to be working ok with this. Although sometimes the mutate relocate
command will keep spawning you in the same level, and other times it will jump you
around all 6 of them. Still no clue as to how the engine is deciding that...

Also was using a mutator to spawn Skaarj with guns and some guns and ammo into
the levels, and that also seems to be working. The stuff is spawning sort of randomly
in all the various levels.

If I can somehow get a mutator to drop some portals of some type into the maps
this thing will be actually playable.
(It almost is now with RSL and the weapon spawning mutators running.)

Grab that alpha version and test it out. Let me know what happens.
 

Wises

New Member
Sep 15, 2008
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grabbed a copy .. let see if I can inject some teleporters into it and reupload for you
 

Wises

New Member
Sep 15, 2008
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hmm .. the DM o RA thing works.. but I don't see the multimap.unr you made or show in the SS's above (ScreenShots)

may I suggest something here.. Come onto our server here: 138.91.34.2:7777

I want to show you a mod which needs some fixing / looking into..
 

MrLoathsome

New Member
Apr 1, 2010
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hmm .. the DM o RA thing works.. but I don't see the multimap.unr you made or show in the SS's above (ScreenShots)

There is no multimap.unr map.

I have never made a map. I can't even tolerate UED long enough to
look at a map with it. Have only used UED ever to export scripts and
play with a few textures/skins.

The only way to see anything like those screenshots while running it, is
to enter Ghost mode and then back way the hell up or down or out into
space. Way way out.

Look at the Readme.txt file.

Although I have figured a bit more out about what is going on tonight
I am still at a loss as to how or why this works the way it does.

Sort of hoping somebody who knows more about how the engine works might
jump in here and tell me what the hell I have done.:eek:

Just did over 4 hours of test practice matches with mutator adding
some weapons, health pickups, Skaarj with guns etc, and it did not
lockup or crash once. Had 24 bots in the game for a while.
It is indeed playable.

At this point I believe I will be able to put something together for
actual release, but it might take a bit of time.

It would be helpful if I could figure out exactly WTF is going on.:rolleyes:

may I suggest something here.. Come onto our server here: 138.91.34.2:7777

I want to show you a mod which needs some fixing / looking into..
Really?:eek2:
I will stop in for a bit to play, but not really interested in taking on any
more major projects ATM. My current UT to-do list is so long it would
probably take me a year to finish it if I could quit my job and work on it
full time.

If the fix for your broken mod is obvious, and can be fixed quickly I may
take a look at it.

**Edit. Tried out your server for a few minutes.

WOW. You got so much running there, that it was impossible to tell what was broken
while playing. Had my netspeed at 8888, but the bytes-in was just saturated.
Servers tickrate seem to be way too high also.

I could only see part of most weapons, and some were invisible.
32 various mutators loaded when I connected...

That GlobalUnreal stuff is definitely broken. Client log just spammed with accessed=none errors.
That eats up a lot of bandwidth and processing time.

If NWUltraGoreSSE, Bleeder or Bloodtrails were even running, I could not tell as all those effects
were being discarded due to the network saturation.

If Bleeder is the broken mod you mention. Well the horrible code in that is what prompted me to
write MoreBlood several years ago.
 
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MrLoathsome

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Apr 1, 2010
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Double post, just to get this thread back on track.

Everybody re-read the first few posts in this thread.

Then try that those alpha gametypes. Look at the Readme.txt file.....:rolleyes:

This contradicts this:
Originally Posted by UnrealScript Language Reference: Last Updated: 12/21/98
All gameplay takes place inside a "level", a self-contained environment containing geometry and actors. Though UnrealServer may be capable of running more than one level simultaneously, each level operates independently, and are shielded from each other: actors cannot travel between levels, and actors on one level cannot communicate with actors on another level.


Actors can relocate/respawn and communicate in multiple levels in the same
game.

Mutators I wrote long before I ever saw this thread, work fine and
spawn pawns/inventory/weapons/players on all 6 of the random
maps with no changes to them at all.

Look at the included source code in the alpha download.
I did NOTHING. Only thing it does is point the default DM and TDM
gametypes at RA maps.

Perhaps I just stumbled upon a bug. But it is a cool bug and I think
I can exploit it.:D

*Edit.

Derp. This post is null and void, but I will leave it here to amuse you.
 
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Wises

New Member
Sep 15, 2008
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hey mate , hmm yes the 32 mutators they don't all run at once btw ;)

the GlobalUnreal yes its a beta .. and timtim knows about the accessed nones..
re: the bleeder , I like that mod.. how the blood spurts up when headshots.. I'am not so much into the moregore mod as its a bit much.. I do have ferali's gore mod running .. but that's only for 1 or 2 gametypes .. and is for muck around games.. not competative one's

the.. mod I was going to get you to look into was actually this one; http://unrealtournament.99.free.fr/utfiles/index.php?dir=GameTypes/LMS/&file=DmLMS.zip

which is a RA spinoff .. but Iam not sure if it works well with other's properly.. that's all. I really like the mod tbh.
I could be wrong.. anyway if you combine it with ; http://unrealtournament.99.free.fr/utfiles/index.php?dir=Mods/&file=RJEnabler100.zip

you pretty much have the RA mod for DM/CTF game's :D

um yeah.

while youre at it , I made a small alteration (been a while using UED) no crashes though ! which was good .. to Deck16][ , basically I added a Sniper Rail up the top and removed the annoying .. Coronas from the sealing :\

Deck16_unr.jpg


Deck16][+.unr .. see if you can figgure out how to get up there without cheating lol... may do a remake one day as it's a ruff as guts job which took me a few hours to do as I have pretty much forgotten all mapping stuff.. had to refer to alot of reading the references from bbdrac website.. (lucky to have that resource)..

perhaps if I get a chance I will make a tutorial on youtube for some of these things one day.. not that I know much.

anyways .. back to initial topic at hand.. running one instance of UT.. and multiple map's.. idk how to do that .. nor have any idea's as such as to how to do it.. I can however do something.. which I'll post shortly.. and that is combine 2 maps into one map.. and link them with tele's I guess that is easy enough.

EDIT Maybe tomorrow.. very tired atm../
 
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MrLoathsome

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Apr 1, 2010
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Derp !

Did I mention that although I have RocketArena installed, I have only
played it once and that was in 2002. :rolleyes:

After actually looking at the maps in the RocketArena game, the DM maps I
thought it was throwing into the mix randomly were just RA map sub-levels
that were copies of the default DM maps.

At that point I said DERP loudly, and felt a bit foolish. :lol:

However I think I have also figured out what I need to make DM/TDM work
on the RA maps however. And learned something new about maps.

Did I mention that I don't know nothing about no maps? :D

@Wises. Don't bother making any new maps with sublevels that
are linked by teleports on my account.
In the event that I do get my idea to work, you could start slapping
maps together using a RA map as a template. Any teleports will get
added by the gametype.

I will stop hijacking this thread now as Wormbo and .:..: have already
provided the correct answer long ago. :cheers::cheers: