Did you go to college

[Jacks:SmirkingRevenge]

did I go to college?
well I am currently in college, so yes.

but this is just phase 1.
phase 2 is taking this crappy Bachelors to D.C. for grad school in order to get my Masters at least.
someday I hope to develop a doctorate in Political Science.

[DarQraven]

What is up with everyone on the internet being so convinced that education is useless? Digg.com is full of that BS, and the same applies here it seems.
Funnily enough, it's always computer science or 'interesting' subjects like languages or psychology.

Try and put yourselves in the shoes of someone who will not score a nice job without proper education.

Wanna be a lawyer? Law school is probably your only way in.
Architect? Try scoring that job without any engineering qualifications.

My guess is the CS guys have it easy because 90% of their knowledge can be learned from the internet. Anyone can buy a UE3 game and screw around with the editor. There's theoretical articles galore.

Meanwhile, I can't honestly practice materials engineering without all kinds of testing equipment that I don't just have lying around my house.

It's not saying anything about the difficulty or importance of said professions, but it does say a lot about how needed college is.

[Sjosz]

Originally Posted by DarQraven

What is up with everyone on the internet being so convinced that education is useless? Digg.com is full of that BS, and the same applies here it seems.
Funnily enough, it's always computer science or 'interesting' subjects like languages or psychology.

Try and put yourselves in the shoes of someone who will not score a nice job without proper education.

Wanna be a lawyer? Law school is probably your only way in.
Architect? Try scoring that job without any engineering qualifications.

My guess is the CS guys have it easy because 90% of their knowledge can be learned from the internet. Anyone can buy a UE3 game and screw around with the editor. There's theoretical articles galore.

Meanwhile, I can't honestly practice materials engineering without all kinds of testing equipment that I don't just have lying around my house.

It's not saying anything about the difficulty or importance of said professions, but it does say a lot about how needed college is.

It entirely depends on the nature of the profession you're rolling into. A lot of professions require degrees of some sort as a pre-requisite to be allowed to work in that sector, which in a lot of cases is fair. On a typical games forum you're going to see people who use PCs during the day for a living, like say people working in the IT industry, or people who have studied CS will respond a lot faster/more to topics. Grain of salt, there. Besides, it's not that the English study I followed is something I think is unnecessary. It's just not for me, too theoretical. (though I do still firmly believe that people who enroll in game design courses are idiots, generally, mostly because they 'want to do something with games')

[T2A`]

Originally Posted by DarQraven

My guess is the CS guys have it easy because 90% of their knowledge can be learned from the internet. Anyone can buy a UE3 game and screw around with the editor. There's theoretical articles galore.

This has nothing to do with CS. At all. It's a very common misconception that CS is equivalent to making games when in reality there's nothing further from the truth.

Most of college is useless. Sure, there are certain areas where you can't do anything without going through a degree program, but there is a ton of bullsh*t in most majors. A BS doesn't mean a whole lot anymore; a masters is required to demonstrate that you actually know anything.

But your incorrect UE3 example does prove one point -- you don't need a degree to get hired if you're good. If you want to make maps for games, you just f**king learn it on your own and get good enough to get a job. You don't go to some useless game development school. That's a total waste. The same can generally be said for programming, web development, and probably stuff like journalism and political science. At least as far as most people take their careers post-college.

[evilmrfrank]

hehehe what T2A said... I went to college for a little less than a year and quit because they weren't even teaching me things I had learned on my own at the age of 14... Game Design colleges also don't seem to like to focus on one area or allow you to do so. They somehow think its a great idea to teach everyone who comes in every aspect of it and try to cram it down your throat that its important to learn it all (Especially programming and math) I quit and got a job cause I worked my butt off to make myself better, anyone else can do the same!

[Jackal]

Originally Posted by Igoy

Currently in my 2nd year of university. I hate it. Luckily only one more year to go.

Thank god I started to save for our honey moon months ago then. yay!

[DarQraven]

Actually, you'll find that was a badly worded sentence on my part. I meant computer oriented studies as a whole. Graphic design, game design, web design, networking, etc. I'm not under any impression that UE3 lessons are given at CS

It would probably make it marginally more interesting, though.

I think it has something to do with the often geeky nature of people involved in computer stuff. People that spend a large part of their day on the internet and actively use it's social aspects are more likely to write tutorials and guides than people who use computers for word processing only.
Plus, you'd have to be out of your mind to write math/dynamics tutorials out of free will

I guess my point is, it's a bit ignorant to call college/university as a whole useless, when it's only a couple of outdated or irrelevant studies. I can name tons of professions where 3 years of university education equal 6 years of messing around on your own.

[Leo(T.C.K.)]

Hell I haven't even completed high school (got deceived etc, it is a long story) and I am without any school for more than year. But I've learned more by myself, than at school, although I do have some serious lacks.
Hell, even back when I was 3 I learned to read and didn't need school for it.

I just wish they didn't require schools everywhere and stuff...

[Wild Weasel]

I took a few engineering classes and hated it, so I left. I'm now an electrician. I make more money than %85 of the engineers I meet (every job site) and work less hours than them too.

[Phopojijo]

Originally Posted by DarQraven

My guess is the CS guys have it easy because 90% of their knowledge can be learned from the internet. Anyone can buy a UE3 game and screw around with the editor. There's theoretical articles galore.

Yeah that's not true at all... a lot of Computer Science is Math -- depending on your field.

Fear the dude who does Cryptography without high-year Abstract Algebra math courses.

[ambershee]

I'd say that most of Computer Science is math. The damned things exist for the sole purpose of crunching ****loads of complex algebra, after all

[(GR)Killer]

Originally Posted by T2A`

This has nothing to do with CS. At all. It's a very common misconception that CS is equivalent to making games when in reality there's nothing further from the truth.

Most of college is useless. Sure, there are certain areas where you can't do anything without going through a degree program, but there is a ton of bullsh*t in most majors. A BS doesn't mean a whole lot anymore; a masters is required to demonstrate that you actually know anything.

But your incorrect UE3 example does prove one point -- you don't need a degree to get hired if you're good. If you want to make maps for games, you just f**king learn it on your own and get good enough to get a job. You don't go to some useless game development school. That's a total waste. The same can generally be said for programming, web development, and probably stuff like journalism and political science. At least as far as most people take their careers post-college.

That's the good thing about the internet. Anyone can learn anything for free. Why waste thousands possibly tens of thousands of dollars doing college classes when you can learn it all on your own PC for no money.

[kiff]

Originally Posted by T2A`

Most of college is useless. Sure, there are certain areas where you can't do anything without going through a degree program, but there is a ton of bullsh*t in most majors.

Many employers want a bachelor's for a reason and they (colleges) also make you take "general ed" for a reason. If you're paying someone a good salary, you want them to be able to write documentation, do common math and have other "basic" skills.

On the flip side, some classes are used as an IQ test. My old physics prof. had this story about how med students bitched about having to take physics and calculus. They confronted the dean about this and he replied "Would you want a surgeon cutting into you that couldn't do freshman physics?"

[Jacks:SmirkingRevenge]

Originally Posted by T2A`

The same can generally be said for programming, web development, and probably stuff like journalism and political science.

journalism?
yes.

political science?
no.
there's virtually no one working in the realm of government or politics that doesn't have a college degree.

[Bersy]

that's cuz they've got all their secret societies and whatnot that launch them into those positions

[DarQraven]

Originally Posted by ambershee

I'd say that most of Computer Science is math. The damned things exist for the sole purpose of crunching ****loads of complex algebra, after all

So what exactly is CS, then? After all, you learn nothing relevant there, if I am to believe the comments in this thread.
I can hardly believe most people would figure out complicated math, physics and the likes on their own. Hell, even the theoretical math students over at my university get pretty intense guidance in their first years, and they're usually the top of math class in high school.

Are we talking "find solution to equation" math or "solve 2nd order differential equation" math here?

[oosyxxx]

Originally Posted by OO7MIKE

4 years. Got a degree.. Best experiences of my life. Helped me find out what I want to do in life.. and I will be paying on that decision for the rest of my life. :P

lol, what? Paying for it the rest of your life? How'd that happen?

[Skold]

i hire IT guys all the time. In order, i prefer: experience, CS degree, any degree except MIS, MIS degree, limbs.

[Phopojijo]

Originally Posted by DarQraven

So what exactly is CS, then? After all, you learn nothing relevant there, if I am to believe the comments in this thread.
I can hardly believe most people would figure out complicated math, physics and the likes on their own. Hell, even the theoretical math students over at my university get pretty intense guidance in their first years, and they're usually the top of math class in high school.

Are we talking "find solution to equation" math or "solve 2nd order differential equation" math here?

Uh... neither and both o.O

What really matters most for computer science peoples is understanding what math is... like what a vector is... what a matrix is... the laws that vectors and other constructs have... understand the rules of discrete math and continuous math... then there comes time to understand what algorithm you're using... like how to quickly solve for the root of a graph... or how to quickly factor a number (or rather that there really isn't a quick way to factor a number... which is why it's useful for cryptography)... maybe even come up with new methods yourself? Most of these problems are solved but -- well -- there still might be new methods out there... maybe even some new instruction or hardware allowed a new solution to exist?

[kiff]

Originally Posted by Phopojijo

maybe even some new instruction or hardware allowed a new solution to exist?

if you're talking quantum computing sure, otherwise it's just speeding up the current paradigms