stormcaller, u aint gona like this

Rostam · Dec 3, 2001

i just wach something on tv, about the seals quite interesting, but after a while an officer says "this is an m14 battle rifle! this is not A PUNY M16! it shoots tru (he says some things i cant remember) and its accurate till 800 yards! we even use them as sniper rifles"

so lets go back to the m16 = puny part, do u think he only says it cuz of the ammo difference?

Kibbles-N-Bits · Dec 3, 2001

so lets go back to the m16 = puny part, do u think he only says it cuz of the ammo difference?

Maybe, but I myself doubt they are as accurate as the M14. M14 vs M16 at 800 yards, the M14 will win.

I think the M16 makes the 500m standard though.

M14...
Caliber: 7.62mm Ball M80
Muzzle Velocity: 853mps (2800FPS)

M16...
Caliber: 5.56mm Ball M193
Muzzle Velocity: 975mps (3200FPS)

M16A1...
Caliber: 5.56mm Ball M193
Muzzle Velocity: 975mps (3200FPS)

M16A2...
Caliber: 5.56mm NATO Ball M855
Muzzle Velocity: 945mps (3100FPS)

Gholam · Dec 3, 2001

Question is, however, how much infantry combat occurs at 800 yards? IIRC, statistics say most infantry engagements are at 300m or less, and at that range, 5.56mm performs far better - lower recoil, lighter weapon, full-auto/burst capability, more ammunition carried, higher wounding/killing potential, and so on.

Kibbles-N-Bits · Dec 3, 2001

The more distance between me and the person I am shooting at, the better... but in closer battles, the M16 will prolly win

Dupre · Dec 3, 2001

Ugh, not the M14 vs. M16 debate again. FYI, the US army and USMC shooting teams both use the M16 in competitions now. Reason why? The M16 is easier to maintain over the rifle's lifespan than the M14. Accuracy-wise, you can get the same score with both rifles.

Gholam · Dec 3, 2001

Kibbles-N-Bits, take into account that the majority of combat situations occur on something else than a completely level terrain, and situations where you have an 800m line of sight to your target are quite rare unless you're a sniper, and have a good sniping position commanding the surrounding terrain... but then you're more likely carrying an M-24/M-40 or something similar.

St0rmcaller · Dec 3, 2001

M-14 wins hands down in terms of shooting accuracy. It is an excellent rifle. I've always liked the idea of of good old fashioned wood and steel over plastic and steel.

But here is the thing (you knew this was coming!)

No buffer spring. Therefore, you can't lay down as much of a sustained rate of fire, as accurately, as you can with the M-16. Gholam has spoken true on the rest of it, so no need for me to repeat that too.

So in other words, that SEAL can go eat a bag of dick. There is truly no point in having the M-14 on the modern battlefield. Typically speaking, the SEAL mission doesn't make sense to have an uber long range weapon anyways.

Kibbles-N-Bits · Dec 3, 2001

I like mah m14 f00!

Sidewinder · Dec 3, 2001

i want a white one! like in rogue spear! and a robar...yeaaaaa a robar! then id be leet!

Profe · Dec 3, 2001

:tup:
I still prefer an M-16

St0rmcaller · Dec 3, 2001

Bah! Infidel defilers! Where is the ash? I can't see the wood! Who painted over daVinci with that Picasso crap?!

Profe · Dec 3, 2001

It looks pretty and blends nicely when hiding in piles of urban camos. I want a rifle so bad, any rifle will do.

Hypenotist · Dec 3, 2001

Professional killers don't need long range weapons.

St0rmcaller · Dec 3, 2001

Originally posted by Hypenotist
Professional killers don't need long range weapons.

Screw you pal! I want them fukkers to die as far away from me as possible!

Kuroshio Apocal · Dec 3, 2001

I believe the SEAL use the M14 becuase

A) Some of them just have a preference for it over the M16A2.
B) It is one of the few rifles that will still fire with water in the barrel, IIRC.

Rostam · Dec 4, 2001

could be kuro, cuz the training was in artic enviroment...

anyway, a few more things i saw was this, in the woods they went prone, in urban places even when the distance between 2 houses was alot, the went kneel, never prone.... i also noticed they were very trigger happy, but maybe they were just spraying so they could retreat once they got attacked

JaFO · Dec 4, 2001

could it be that
they just don't like the rifle because it wasn't made for them ... (it was for the 'regular' army, so it can't be good enough for the seals/navy/marines ...)

The_Fur · Dec 4, 2001

and why you see them fire full auto so much is because it is imperative for a small unit to look as big as possible, that'swhy you see most spec op units carry so many lmg's.

If the enemy found out it was just 5 guys they'd be overrun faster then you can say "please don't kill me"

Goat Fucker · Dec 4, 2001

The reason the M14 is still in service, apart from beeing the only real battle rifle the US ever had, is that it handles some conditions allot better than the M16's, like extreme heat or could, not to mention mud and other nasty things.

Arguably it should have been replaced by the H&K G3 A4 long ago, but thats where money and politics sticks it ugly head into all of it.

Gholam · Dec 4, 2001

Shayetet 13 (the Israeli SEALs) use AKM's, that's where reliability is

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