PDA

View Full Version : Mod authoring and new models


trasko
5th Nov 2001, 03:43 PM
so... I have a mod that has its textures and all the code tied up in the .u file that is generated...

Now I have some models I'd like to use in this mod (most are models I've downloaded off the net -- they are all .umod files) How should I put all the stuff together so it all one nice package and easy to reference in my code?

Having a bunch of seperate .u files for each model and for the game seems dumb. Does anyone know what I should do about this?

Thanks,

trasko

Postal
5th Nov 2001, 06:31 PM
Let me guess, you want to use models of other mods with out permission and want to rip them out of the mod their from so you can use them in your mod?

If you want those models, you have to have the source files, and compile them into your package.

trasko
5th Nov 2001, 07:29 PM
well, like i said, these are .umod files i downloaded from the net. i plan on contacting the makers of these models, but by distributing them on the internet i can only assume they want them used by whoever wants to use them. i have no intention of making any money off of my mod...

so like i asked... is there no way i can get the source out of the .umod? i can "ucc updateumod blah.umod LIST" on it and see what it contains... and then install the .umod and gather up its pieces, but this doesn't include the actual model files (*.3d). i can get the textures, sounds, music, and code of out however.

thanks again guys,

trask

Postal
5th Nov 2001, 08:52 PM
Hmm, well some people would get very mad, I for instant would hunt people down and break legs, but thats just me.

Many people open source their code, others dont, If its not said to be ok, I would advise against it.

You can get the source code easy, and most people do that to study the code, but using it is an another story.

Hell if I figured people would try and use anything I coded for their own benifit I would have never released anything, I would have never released anything.

I see nothing wrong with dling somehting and ripping it apart to learn how it works, otherwise there would be hardly any coders
but using it crosses what most of us see as acceptable.

You can get the code, and export model frames, but using it is what I would advise against.

Papapishu
6th Nov 2001, 07:01 PM
Well if you make something in Unrealscript, you can't com claiming that you own it, because anyone can get the sourcecode.
Thinking that you can release a mod and have the code "copyrighted" is quite stupid, because everything you put into the Unreal Community is automaticaly Open Source...
Unless you find a way to make it unreadable...
But then again, it's only good maners to give credit where credit is due, so to speak...

Postal
6th Nov 2001, 08:18 PM
Code can be made unreadable

Think what Bill Gates would do if someone decompiled Win Me and recompiled it under a new name and gave it at way for free.

If you keep that attiidue, expect all further mod releases from me to be made undecompileable

You are either stubbon headed or an idiot, there is the idea of intelectualy property, and you could be sued for coping ideas(but few of us care enought to do so, but there are a few)

Take care for if you are so willing to steal stuff, expect reprucussion

Captain Kewl
6th Nov 2001, 08:24 PM
Actually, all you need to do to copyright *any* text is explicitly say that it's copywritten. And yes, this will hold up in a court of law -- provided that it actually is your original property to begin with.

That's the thing with Unreal mods: so much of it is derivative, if not from other mod authors, than from Epic/DE/Legend/Ion/etc. themselves. It's kind of pointless being posessive over something that's not really yours to begin with.

Openly visible *doesn't* mean open-source, though. I can't just copy articles from the New York Times and then publish them in my own book if I didn't even write the articles to begin with. If you're working with a new algorithm of basing a gametype on code that's distinctly someone elses, basically something that you wouldn't have come up with yourself, it's only good form to at the very least credit them.

I'd say borrowing models is an even hairier beast, since it's visible without going under the hood and thus EXPLICITLY not yours to anyone who's seen it before -- very easy for anyone to get the wrong idea and think that they were just ripped off. I'd be careful and make absolutely certain that recycling the models is cool with the other authors *before* even thinking about putting them in.

Postal
6th Nov 2001, 08:26 PM
Most people will give you an ok if you ask, but taking is a real no no.

mr.s-d
6th Nov 2001, 09:50 PM
Exactly, it's polite to ask and respect the author's wishes.

2COOL4-U
7th Nov 2001, 09:24 AM
I don't pretty much mind people using my code, but I really think you should first try to find a way to do it yourself. If you don't find a way to do so look at the source code to learn from it and get a new idea, but copying code is not cool at all(Unless the coder permits you to use it code).

[NDBC]Hoshi
8th Nov 2001, 05:23 PM
Itīs much better to start coding by yourself (modeling, mapping, skinning). I recently started urealscipt coding and learned the most by reading tutorials and looking at other code. However by using cut, copy and paste you actually do not learn anything (ok you learn how to copy code). Besides if have problems with your code, just ask someone in this forum or some cool guys like 2-COOL-4-U...
Ripping of other mods is lamer stuff, just try something new and exciting.

EasyRaider
9th Nov 2001, 07:05 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm sure I read somewhere that all UnrealScript code is open source. That does not mean it's OK to take it without giving credit to the author, though. And you can not use other people's models, textures, sound and music without permission.

trasko
9th Nov 2001, 08:16 AM
so like i said twice: i have no interest in "stealing" anyones work. i respect their talent and rights to keep "their stuff". i wouldn't appreciate spending 5 months on a mod and have some else claim it was theirs.

but on the other hand, why ever make a model if you don't want to see it in the game? maybe you just want to use it yourself and be cool right? then why upload it to model sites so anyone can download it? probably because the maker is cool and wants to share their cool creation with everyone else. so i think that using the models in a mod is what any modeller would ever want.

i'd be nice if people took bits and pieces of my code as inspiration for something they make or to make their lives easier -- it means someone realizes that what i've done is good and worth using again somewhere else. but anyways...

it doesn't even matter if i completely rip off people or if people rip me off; it really is very far from the end of the world. and on top of that, i haven't figured out a clean way of integrating models out of .u files into my source (the point of this whole thread).

in summary: you guys should chill ;)


trasko

Captain Kewl
9th Nov 2001, 09:12 AM
Er... Reread the posts. Nobody's saying DON'T DO IT YOU'RE A BAD PERSON GO TO HELL. The point is this:

MAKE SURE IT'S OKAY TO USE THE MODELS BEFORE YOU DO SO.

Just contact the authors and ask permission. They'll probably say yes. If you ask, they'll probably give you their sources too, which is probably a good deal easier than ripping them from the packages anyway.

Postal
9th Nov 2001, 03:04 PM
Yes modelers want people to see their work, but not to take it and use it for what every they want.

If you are unwilling to listen to what we are trying to say, I see no need to continue arguing, or tell you what you need to know.

trasko
9th Nov 2001, 03:21 PM
dill

blah blah blah