Questions and suggestions...

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Red Honda

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I'm fairly new to Infiltration, but I've been a hard-core PC gamer for longer than I would like to admit, and I wanted to bring up a couple of issues/suggestions regarding some things that could maybe, possibly, perhaps be tweaked in the next version.

Sorry if this stuff has been discussed, but I'm not going to rummage through globs of forum threads looking to see if they've been addressed previously.

First, can someone point me to a good (working) bot tweaker? I find the bots in 2.86 to be either God-like marksmen, or complete idiots. I realize there are limitations and that the INF bot code is not complete, but if there is a prog out there that will at least dull the pain a little bit... (I did see a link in another thread, but it was busted.)

Another thing... bots and closed doors don't always mix. I see them walking in place against closed doors alot on most (but not all) maps. Is this a path noding issue, bot code, or a combo of both? The one thing that I can't stand is when a bot is on the other side of a closed door that the bot won't/can't open and I can see thier weapon or even a part of thier body sticking through the door. Sure, it's an easy kill through the door, and even a bit fun sometimes, but it's definately no challenge.

Question: Can thier AI be adjusted so that they won't get that close to a closed door, yet still be close enough to open it?

Speaking of which... I feel that the "radius of influence" (pardon my makeshift jargon) for the grab/use function is too small. In most cases I have to lower my weapon and smash my face against doors before I can open the damn things. Granted, I don't want to be able to open it from 10 feet away either. Arms length would be nice though.

Suggestion: Increase the distance needed to activate doors (a little) AND add an animation of the players' arm reaching out and turning/switching the doorknob/lightswitch, etc. (Adds to realism.) Perhaps even during that time that your "activating hand" is not on your weapon, your recoil would be even worse, which would prompt you to be even more cautious when opening doors. Again, this would more closely resemble real-world actions/conditions.

In general, playing against bots is usually intense and rewarding despite thier flaws, but what about hearing and vision enhancements? Without going deep into it, what about giving the bots the ability to "hear"? I can jump up and down, fire weapons... make all kinds of noise on the other side of a door or wall, but the bots have no clue that I'm there without seeing me. What's possible here and what is not?

In addition, what about the bots ability, or rather thier INability to see players that are hiding in the shadows? Granted, they sometimes don't see you even if you are in the open sunlight, but again... I'm just posing questions as to what is possible.

Here's an idea for the future.
You have decided to hole up inside of a structure (sniper opps, flag station, whatever). How about the ability to lock the doors from the inside? This would force the opposing team to have to breach the door with force. The options could be to shotgun the door (depending on door type), a breaching charge (new equipment item), or perhaps even lockpicking? How about kicking it down? (Time consuming, noisy... but realistic!) Granted, this type of thing would be mostly for online play as the bots have enough trouble just opening doors, let alone breaching locked ones. :)

Yes? No? Hey, I don't have the answers, just questions. Discuss the options. What do you guys think?

That's it for now. Thanks for reading. ;)

Peace, out. :D
 

NotBillMurray

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Mar 11, 2001
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Welcome to INF. A great post BTW.

Here is DLL's Infiltration Bot Tweaker (found by typing in 'bot tweaker' in the search field ;))

- About the door issue, the weapon is an excellent guide of how far you really are from something. Just imagine that you are holding a rifle. Could you grab a doorknob any closer IRL than you can in INF? The animation would be fun, but how hard would that be to target the item being manipulated?

- The art of bot intelligence is being refined by the team with every patch. The last batch were fresh from the home lobotomy training school. I hope they could put hearing in, just no idea when. There is a significant part of the community that only plays off-line, so you aren't alone.

- About breaching ... ahh if only! Maybe in UW (the next engine that INF is likely to go towards).
 

Profe

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hehe it would be fun to have an animation for the guy trying to reach the door and not being able to hehe that would look stupid:p
p.s. im not saynig your ideas are stupid:eek:
 

Red Honda

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Ahh... wow! That was quick. :)

Thanks for the bot tweaker link! I'll give it a go.

As for the animation of the arm reaching for the doorknob, lightswitch or whatever, I guess I should have elaborated on the fact that I was trying to suggest something that would give the game more immersiveness and realism in the visuals area. No, I wouldn't want to have to "aim" for the doorknob with my hand, which is a good counterpoint, BTW. :D

It's just that most of the time, it appears that I'm well within arms reach (or weapons length) of a door and it won't open (or close) when I hit my grab/use key. Well, let's just say that 9 out of 10 times, my body passes thru the door geometry as it opens or closes. :) They got weapon collision (which is GREAT), but the doors won't collide with your body... hmmm...

Okay, okay... LOL.. I won't open that can of worms about how much of a pain it would be to get hung up on door collision code. Just making a point. :)

I'm glad that I'm not alone when it comes to botplay. Let's face it, sometimes we get tired (and pissed) playing with other peeps once in awhile, not to mention that even my cable modem isn't always the fastest on the block. I think bots have a huge future in solo gameplay and I'm excited to see further developements.

Thanks for posting! :D
 

the vrrc

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Jun 16, 2001
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VrrC: I only play with bots.

bot49: ya damn straight!

VrrC: Good post, none of this has been really suggested before. I like the idea with the animation, but when you move, other animations overide it. (Such as the 3rd person loading animation.) Still, that would be cool. :tup:
 

JaFO

bugs are features too ...
Nov 5, 2000
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Just don't forget there are more bot-editors/tweakers out there .. ;)
I think I won't delay the release of v2.0 anymore.
So look for the new & improved version tonight (I just hope that Murphy guy doesn't show ;)) ...
// ---

The locking/breaching of doors sounds good, altough I wonder how the existing maps could make use of such a feature without requiring the mappers to edit the map.

// Red Honda :
Try to avoid posting several ideas in one post with a generic topic, you'll see that your ideas get 'processed' faster ... (ie the team is more likely to see what you posted)
 

DarkBls

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Mar 5, 2000
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Originally posted by A_Rimmerlister
Try to avoid posting several ideas in one post with a generic topic, you'll see that your ideas get 'processed' faster ... (ie the team is more likely to see what you posted)

Goood point !
 

hawaiian c

)(åwåiiåñ ç
Jan 10, 2001
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hehe wow bls i bet u was reading this from the time of the frist post and thinking" man should i wait till someone notice they got too the point where this a generic topic and then post?" lol na

yah the bots seemm too be a dam good sharp shooter
 

Red Honda

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A'ight, next time I'll keep my posts simpler and more direct. I have a near-phobia, complex or whatever you might call it that I'm not explaining things clearly enough.

I see lots of posts like, "Bots play good, but need more guns and lights would b cool too."

Anyway. Point taken. Thx. :D
 

DarkBls

Inf Ex-admin
Mar 5, 2000
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Long posts are good. It shows yu are not lazy !
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But after your deep post, add something like :

< suggestion >
< Author >Red Honda< /Author >
< text >Summary of your idea/problem< /text >
< /suggestion >


I know, I know.. I need to read something else than XML Draft..
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