PDA

View Full Version : Ctf-Fin (take 2)


Wanderer
9th Feb 2000, 11:19 PM
Ok, 2nd shot at this. Yes, as a standard issue CTF map it was damn near impossible (but if ya got lucky...). So I changed the theme a bit from barren desert to redwood tree sized forest. A little darker but should still be bright enough for you guys with the jacked up brightness settings.

Still no guns (I'll probally let you guys decide which ones), bots are fully functioning, and I'm gonna see if I can't make it any faster.
http://members.xoom.com/Wanderer22/unreal/CTF-Fin.zip

Bugs, complaints, suggestions, just post it.

10th Feb 2000, 01:07 AM
You ought to read my post here, in regard to Fin and Them, to understand this post. http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~unreal/modcentral/html/Forum21/HTML/000018.html

I just played the new map and I hate to say it, but I liked the desert one better. I imagine you hate to hear it more, with all the changes youve been doing. Again, the trees provide cover, but not enough. You need to be able to move, take cover from fire and shoot back, which the trees dont allow. Having smaller covering objects allows this, and would make it an intense game like you have with Them. See the other posts about textures, and if you mixed the flooring up some, there are lots of different grasses out there, it would also add to it.

They are both fun maps though, and I really dont care for CTF, so its an extra big compliment.

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

[This message has been edited by coffeycan (edited 02-09-2000).]

10th Feb 2000, 01:07 AM
You ought to read my post here, in regard to Fin and Them, to understand this post. http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~unreal/modcentral/html/Forum21/HTML/000018.html

I just played the new map and I hate to say it, but I liked the desert one better. I imagine you hate to hear it more, with all the changes youve been doing. Again, the trees provide cover, but not enough. You need to be able to move, take cover from fire and shoot back, which the trees dont allow. Having smaller covering objects allows this, and would make it an intense game like you have with Them. See the other posts about textures, and if you mixed the flooring up some, there are lots of different grasses out there, it would also add to it.

They are both fun maps though, and I really dont care for CTF, so its an extra big compliment.

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

[This message has been edited by coffeycan (edited 02-09-2000).]

Wanderer
10th Feb 2000, 06:09 PM
Read it all last time, yeah I know I need to spruce it up a bit. Gotta know though that Ctf-Them was created in a 2hr spiel sometime around midnight so my brain was set to off. Hmm... maybe that's the key...

I'll see what I can do about Fin though. Big rocks... anyways, I honestly figured that you could tell which side you were on by looking at the bunker stripes. Wonder what a big beacon would look like at the top of the bunkers? Nah /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

And I used that grass texture in Fin simply because it's different and is commonly used. I guess I got really bored of the usual grass. But back to the sahara!

10th Feb 2000, 07:20 PM
Its not that the map needs sprucing up, just a little variation added. It really is a fun map. I wish I could make a map as intense as Them in less than two hours

I think I may have confused you, I think you CAN tell which bunker is which without the colors, and that adding real world textures is what should happen. If anything you could make the bunkers two different types of metal and that would differentiate them just fine.

Rocks, broken walls, tree stands, whatever, as long as its small and gives cover the same way that them does. You've got a good map that I thinkis really fun, I cant wait to see the changes. Stay in touch about it
CC


------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

10th Feb 2000, 07:20 PM
Its not that the map needs sprucing up, just a little variation added. It really is a fun map. I wish I could make a map as intense as Them in less than two hours

I think I may have confused you, I think you CAN tell which bunker is which without the colors, and that adding real world textures is what should happen. If anything you could make the bunkers two different types of metal and that would differentiate them just fine.

Rocks, broken walls, tree stands, whatever, as long as its small and gives cover the same way that them does. You've got a good map that I thinkis really fun, I cant wait to see the changes. Stay in touch about it
CC


------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

Wolfn2it
10th Feb 2000, 11:53 PM
THEM rocked dude, sorry to say that FIN was not as good...I dont think it was but dont quit making maps-I enjoy playing the hell outta them

------------------
Kill'em all and let God separte 'em!!!

Wanderer
11th Feb 2000, 12:46 AM
True, I definitely like Ctf-Them better myself but I think it was almost too DM-ish (new word for the minute). Also it was very small and funneled everybody threw 1 pipe. So you were guaranteed to find something to shoot. Although I'm debating those grenade launchers.

The thing with Ctf-Fin though is right now I've moved from the empty desert (bad idea), redwood forest (half decent idea), to the big rocks section (small rocks are gonna kill the framerate). I was thinking of adding in bits of Ctf-Them like the ruin walls. But since it's not nearly as funneled, my fear is it could also severly cut down on the action department. So somehow I've got to find a medium with this. In fact until I hit that medium all the other detail stuff (weapons, ammo, health, bunker deco's) aren't even gonna be bothered with.

So here goes, version 3. Big rocks. If ya want the ruin walls please insert foot into my mouth and refrain from the steel toe boots. Btw if the rocks are kind of steep it's because I don't want you climbing them. That's just asking for framerate troubles.
http://members.xoom.com/Wanderer22/unreal/CTF-Fin.zip

And this started as an AS map to /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

RegularX
11th Feb 2000, 02:35 AM
Just d'led the map and tested it out....

1) Are ya the Wanderer who keeps popping up on unrealized? if so, hi! /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
2) Awesome start. With the interesting fascination people have CTF and sniping, I think this has potential. Reminds me of cs_desert for CounterStrike, minus the annoying framerate.
2a) Great outdoors terrain

I only tried the 'big rocks' version but I would recommend:

1) Making a greater variety of buildings around the flags. The bunkers are good, but I get no sense of base, makes nav hard too
2) With the nav part, it seems to lack major key points, parts of the map to distinguish themselves (lake, river, mountain, M16 cave, whatever)
3) Gotta see this with some bot-pathing to get a feel for it.
4) Same with weapon placement. I wouldn't be shy about throwing some around just to try it out.

[This message has been edited by RegularX (edited 02-11-2000).]

11th Feb 2000, 04:46 AM
The best version yet dude, good job.

But, did you put bot paths in? They didnt do anything during the game.

If you could change the textures around the base of the bunkers to be that steel mesh texture that you have partly there, that would be cool.

The terrain is great, I like the rolls and peaks, has a great feel to it. And the daylight is great, too, please do not darken it. The new textured bunkers are great, did you give any thought to having two different but real world textures to show teams bunkers? Keep up the great work, cant wait to see the next beta.
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

11th Feb 2000, 04:46 AM
The best version yet dude, good job.

But, did you put bot paths in? They didnt do anything during the game.

If you could change the textures around the base of the bunkers to be that steel mesh texture that you have partly there, that would be cool.

The terrain is great, I like the rolls and peaks, has a great feel to it. And the daylight is great, too, please do not darken it. The new textured bunkers are great, did you give any thought to having two different but real world textures to show teams bunkers? Keep up the great work, cant wait to see the next beta.
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

Wanderer
11th Feb 2000, 05:30 PM
RegularX: Yes, I'm the same Wanderer from Unrealized, Rust's Unreal Editing forum (more commonly associated with Wolf's Unreal), and PlanetUnreal's Editing forum. My current plan is to bring fledging newbies to new heights, give them wings and watch them fall /infopop/emoticons\icon_wink.gif
Those that live will be hired /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Now to answer the rest:

1) "More variety"
Ok, anybody know of any good sites where I can pull pics of this kind of stuff from? Cause mainly I've been pulling things I can remember from Delta Force (and there wasn't much in terms of bases in CTF games).

2) "Bot Paths"
I thought I did that... odd I'll go back through it again and make sure it's in their for the next one.

3) "Weapons, or lack there of"
Ok, until I get the initial lay of the land done, no guns! /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
So what ya start with is what ya get. I've lately been testing it with the M16, MP5, M3, and giving myself some spare clips.

4) "Key points/landmarks"
When did this become a roadtrip? /infopop/emoticons\icon_wink.gif
What would I put though? I can't really fit a river in there (where would it go?). I guess I could fit a pond in the middle but considering that the land I used is actually just squares it would look strange. If I made it bigger and gave a town in the middle it could prove interesting but would probally be just too big.

5) "base of the bunkers to be that steel mesh texture"
Like the floor is on the inside of the bunkers? Or should I change it altogether?

6) "did you give any thought to having two different but real world textures to show teams bunkers"

Ok, you lost me there. Real world? I live in a suburban hell where nothing happens (why do you think it started as a barren desert?). I'm gonna snag some of the textures at the Map Depot and try those out and see if it looks better. And yes I have certainly considered it, it's just a matter of whether or not my 3 brain cells can make use of it /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Man, hope I can squeeze this in time for the release of the IMP.

11th Feb 2000, 06:07 PM
If you want to do real world mapping you got to have those texture packs from SOB, they are all really good, especailly A3 and Citytex, theres tons of good textures, concrete brick, youll be up to your eyeballs in choices for your bunkers /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Im not so concerned about changing the texture to the flooring as much as I am of getting rid of that space agey-looking one on the sides of the bunker, heck, use one for the floor and a rusty one for the outside.

When I was talking about more variety I mean in the ground textures, not the layout or anything, just some suttle differences, thats all. You could also do something like throw in boxes or barrles around the bukner too, that would add to the realism.

I dont think that the map needs landmarks, you play it a couple of times, and you have it down. Sorry RegX /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Yeah, somethings off with the botpaths, they just stand there, no response to commands.

Im dying to see the next version, I have a special affinity for outdor maps (if you cant tell)
CC


------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

11th Feb 2000, 06:07 PM
If you want to do real world mapping you got to have those texture packs from SOB, they are all really good, especailly A3 and Citytex, theres tons of good textures, concrete brick, youll be up to your eyeballs in choices for your bunkers /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Im not so concerned about changing the texture to the flooring as much as I am of getting rid of that space agey-looking one on the sides of the bunker, heck, use one for the floor and a rusty one for the outside.

When I was talking about more variety I mean in the ground textures, not the layout or anything, just some suttle differences, thats all. You could also do something like throw in boxes or barrles around the bukner too, that would add to the realism.

I dont think that the map needs landmarks, you play it a couple of times, and you have it down. Sorry RegX /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Yeah, somethings off with the botpaths, they just stand there, no response to commands.

Im dying to see the next version, I have a special affinity for outdor maps (if you cant tell)
CC


------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

RegularX
11th Feb 2000, 06:59 PM
ahh, I had forgotten that you could specify the loadout. Although trying to snipe the bots with the handgun was kinda fun /infopop/emoticons\icon_wink.gif.

I guess with the landmark thingy was just that I found it easy to get lost, even after playing the map a couple of times.

The lighting definately rocks. Nice skybox too, although the borders seemed pretty easy to hit.

Wanderer
11th Feb 2000, 08:33 PM
Ok, not much of an update, some minor stuff but it should keep you tide over till I can get some more in here. Consider this ver 3.1

Citytex.utx is now a required file now, I won't add it to the zip though till it's done.

For the most part, minor texture changes, bots were re-path noded, and it should run a bit smoother.

I'll probally have an actual new version out sometime by midnight.

Same link as before (I'm getting lazy http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~unreal/modcentral/html/sarcblink.gif )

I'm thinking for the next version that I start you off in a small bunker behind everything so it doesn't seem to be a bit random on where you start. What ya think?

Varying the ground is gonna be hard. I already upped the scale of the ground texture to 2 cause of repetitiveness. And I'm kind of afraid of adding more detail to the terrain because I'll end up lowering the framerate in the process.

Oh, if it seems easy to hit the borders, well that's intentional. If I don't setup an invisible wall, the player can wander off too far and cause problems (ie: nothing to shoot at and get lost).

12th Feb 2000, 02:57 PM
New texturing is great, and the botpathing as well, good idea by adding the citytex file.

Im wondering if the verdict on this map will be out until the bot fix comes out with 2.7.1, since their aim is so good, the need for cover and staying out of their LOS is extra important. Therefore when they fix goes in the cover may be just fine.

Do start the tea off in one area, have you seen the NBTeams mod that Beppo did? It allows this. Its a good idea as this is the way that INF wil be heading anyway.

What happens to the FPS when you add a small rock, one just big enough to crouch behind, into the wide open areas of the map, have you tried it?

Thanks, cant wait for the new beta
CC



------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

12th Feb 2000, 02:57 PM
New texturing is great, and the botpathing as well, good idea by adding the citytex file.

Im wondering if the verdict on this map will be out until the bot fix comes out with 2.7.1, since their aim is so good, the need for cover and staying out of their LOS is extra important. Therefore when they fix goes in the cover may be just fine.

Do start the tea off in one area, have you seen the NBTeams mod that Beppo did? It allows this. Its a good idea as this is the way that INF wil be heading anyway.

What happens to the FPS when you add a small rock, one just big enough to crouch behind, into the wide open areas of the map, have you tried it?

Thanks, cant wait for the new beta
CC



------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

Wanderer
12th Feb 2000, 05:11 PM
As it is right now, I'm kind of pushing the Unreal engine in terms of acceptable speed in outdoor environments. Smaller rocks, while they aren't as big can lower the framerate, especially from a distance. The bigger rocks help keep polys from being drawn and help increase the framerate. That's kind of why everythings been a little larger then life. Then again the rocks are also a bit steep to try to keep people off of them.

Beppo's NBTeamgame is good for a TeamDM game but that's not up right now. Certainly an option if you have any ideas you want to pass on though.

Some changes with this version.
4 Start areas, 2 for each team. There in the back.
Weapons supplied in every bunker as well as a little health (only vials, I want everyone to die /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif )
Might be a hit in framerate.
Fixed a sky problem.
http://members.xoom.com/Wanderer22/unreal/CTF-Fin.zip

Ooh... interesting. I just found out to make use of larger textures (upwards of 1024x1024). Problem is I don't know if they'll work with cards other then S3's. I'll keep looking into this though.

12th Feb 2000, 07:44 PM
Wanderer,

Love the bunker start out and the boxes in the bukers are cool (what tex pack are those in?).

Any way that you could put one or two of the boxes outside the bunkers? And the rocks arent too big to keep me off, great for sniping, but not too good as they leave you exposed as hell, which great, you dont want a perfect postion in any map.

The only issue are the doors, the bots bump their heads on that bar at the top and cannot make it in, you could reverse it, like a garage door, and take that ledge off the top, theres even some good textures for the door in Citytex and A3, Slums too I think.

Did you see my post to you about Blackwings, I gave you the Nali addy.
Keeps getting better and better.
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

12th Feb 2000, 07:44 PM
Wanderer,

Love the bunker start out and the boxes in the bukers are cool (what tex pack are those in?).

Any way that you could put one or two of the boxes outside the bunkers? And the rocks arent too big to keep me off, great for sniping, but not too good as they leave you exposed as hell, which great, you dont want a perfect postion in any map.

The only issue are the doors, the bots bump their heads on that bar at the top and cannot make it in, you could reverse it, like a garage door, and take that ledge off the top, theres even some good textures for the door in Citytex and A3, Slums too I think.

Did you see my post to you about Blackwings, I gave you the Nali addy.
Keeps getting better and better.
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

Wanderer
12th Feb 2000, 09:28 PM
Yeah the door was a mistake on my part. I never bothered to play test it before I uploaded it. I reuploaded it fixed now so now you can entertain yourself.

I don't think I'll release anymore versions until I can think of anything more significant to add to it. Lately it's just been minor stuff.

And ya, I saw the response you sent to the Blackwing's thanks. I was dinking around and saw that 1 post on it and figured I'ld review it and give the guy some feedback but just never got around to it.

Ok, same link as before.
/me stamps on the map "Property of CoffeeCan"

Post edit: (Time- 7:35pm)This map has got to come to a close soon cause I'm starting to get sloppy. Left a nasty BSP hole... errr. Ok, now it's good.

[This message has been edited by Wanderer (edited 02-12-2000).]

Wolfn2it
12th Feb 2000, 10:24 PM
Awesome come back dude this CTF-Fin is a lot better than the forest, I saw a DM-Mars that had trees and stuff in it not a very good map but maybe you can get some ideas and texturing from it (its a forst-like map) you did say you did fix the door problem then? I keep getting stuck in the flag area especially if a bot is trying to get in..hmmm but this is a lot better i redl the new one thanks for the fix (if its there)

------------------
Kill'em all and let God separte 'em!!!

Wanderer
13th Feb 2000, 12:17 AM
If you downloaded it after the time, it should be fixed (that's kind of why I posted a time). But it was something overlooked and didn't think of so that was my fault. So try redownloading it. If it's not fixed then check the date, it might be old and actually being retrieved from the cache folder instead of site.

If you can think of anything that I need to add or needs to be removed, keep posting and I'll keep updating.

Btw, anybody know of a texture artist willing to create a 1024x1024 texture for the ground on this map? It's possible to import a texture that size, I know how now.

[This message has been edited by Wanderer (edited 02-12-2000).]

13th Feb 2000, 03:33 AM
Just two things:

There looks to be a poly glitch around the first bunker when you head straight out from the red side.

I think youll have to change the door format, the bots still get stuck, I played it for 15 minutes and they sat in front the entire time, didnt get in once. Having the door raise would be cool, like a garage door.

Other than that, I agree its ready to go. Let me know when the final version is out and Ill post it on the site. Thanks for taking all the time you did, its a great map.
CC


------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

13th Feb 2000, 03:33 AM
Just two things:

There looks to be a poly glitch around the first bunker when you head straight out from the red side.

I think youll have to change the door format, the bots still get stuck, I played it for 15 minutes and they sat in front the entire time, didnt get in once. Having the door raise would be cool, like a garage door.

Other than that, I agree its ready to go. Let me know when the final version is out and Ill post it on the site. Thanks for taking all the time you did, its a great map.
CC


------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

Wolfn2it
13th Feb 2000, 03:36 AM
Is it just me or is the new update a little messed up? Is there a way to fix it? whenever i look around the texturing gets distorted and the pictures messes up.

------------------
Kill'em all and let God separte 'em!!!

13th Feb 2000, 12:45 PM
Yeah, thats the glitch that im talking about, it mainly occurs around that first bunker area when you head out from the read flag spot, right?
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

13th Feb 2000, 12:45 PM
Yeah, thats the glitch that im talking about, it mainly occurs around that first bunker area when you head out from the read flag spot, right?
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

Wanderer
13th Feb 2000, 05:28 PM
Got it fixed don't worry. I just uploaded it so that's the final version, includes all necessary files and the usual text file. Now time to go back to Ctf-Them and see what I can add to that before it gets too wierd.

CoffeeCan, it's all yours! Be brutal on the review /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

13th Feb 2000, 05:56 PM
Dude after all the work that you put into it? All the suggestions you took, all the work you did? You are the ideal mapper! If all is well after I play it, youll get a great review (havent yet, but just had to respond), you deserve it.
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

13th Feb 2000, 05:56 PM
Dude after all the work that you put into it? All the suggestions you took, all the work you did? You are the ideal mapper! If all is well after I play it, youll get a great review (havent yet, but just had to respond), you deserve it.
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.cablelink.com/realworld/index.html

15th Feb 2000, 02:30 PM
Wanderer,

Is there any way that you can fix those doors, they open and close at random times and the bots have a hard time with them (not as bad as before though). I really dont want to review it with those doors, aned its the last thing that Ill ask for-honest. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

The map is even more enjoyable with 2.71 though, the open spaces arent as threatenting as they once were and it supports tactical gameplay, which is awesome. I encourage everyone to dowload the map from one of the above posts.
Thanks
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:

http://www.planetunreal.com/realmaps/

15th Feb 2000, 02:30 PM
Wanderer,

Is there any way that you can fix those doors, they open and close at random times and the bots have a hard time with them (not as bad as before though). I really dont want to review it with those doors, aned its the last thing that Ill ask for-honest. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

The map is even more enjoyable with 2.71 though, the open spaces arent as threatenting as they once were and it supports tactical gameplay, which is awesome. I encourage everyone to dowload the map from one of the above posts.
Thanks
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:

http://www.planetunreal.com/realmaps/

Wanderer
15th Feb 2000, 11:30 PM
Thanks for that, I thought I had that fixed (several times now). So I changed the door slightly (horizontal instead of vertical). I also redid all the pathnodes to ensure the bots worked.

I probally would've had this done earlier but I've been looking for Visual C++ 6.0 all day.

Play tested, chink approved, CoffeyCan designed... /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif http://members.xoom.com/Wanderer22/unreal/CTF-Fin.zip

16th Feb 2000, 01:08 AM
Now could you just... /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:

http://www.planetunreal.com/realmaps/

16th Feb 2000, 01:08 AM
Now could you just... /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:

http://www.planetunreal.com/realmaps/

Wolfn2it
16th Feb 2000, 02:59 PM
Hey dude just dl and tried it out. THIS ROCKS MORE BETTER!! (is more better a word?) anyway I like the doors now its alot easier. Hell now I got like 15 bots running around and killing the hell outta each other. hehehe not worth getting the flag everytime I do they mow me down in the barracks with the flag (if I get that far)...any way awesome map! /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

------------------
Kill'em all and let God separte 'em!!!

17th Feb 2000, 02:40 PM
Wanderer- The review is up at Real Maps, and I put the map on gamespy for DL, so no more going to xoom. Take a look tell me what you think. Again great job dude, such a fun map, LMK when Them is ready too.
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.planetunreal.com/realmaps/

[This message has been edited by coffeycan (edited 02-17-2000).]

17th Feb 2000, 02:40 PM
Wanderer- The review is up at Real Maps, and I put the map on gamespy for DL, so no more going to xoom. Take a look tell me what you think. Again great job dude, such a fun map, LMK when Them is ready too.
CC

------------------
Want to be an Infiltrator? Get the goods at:
http://www.planetunreal.com/realmaps/

[This message has been edited by coffeycan (edited 02-17-2000).]