points AND killz?

[[L]the_Countess]

i can hear some of you thing
somebody whining about the point system again

ATM its 1 hit is 1 point
it whould probably be hard to change
but....
(and you are now thinking he is gona start about the shotguns)
thats a bit unfair for non-shotgun users
(congratulation you win :p )

im not asking to change the point system but rater to add a "kill counter" (lacing a better name for it)
add the amount of enamy you have actualy killed
that whould give some creadit to the hard working MG/sniper people that still dont beat the shotgun users in points bespite having many more killz

i read somewhere you where planing to add something like this for TK's so it should be posible

[The_Fur]

It's being changed to a system ala Crapper Strike, 1 kill 1 point. Ofcourse I would put the entire frag system trough the woodchipper, just be glad it isn't up to me.

[{LOD}WolfBear]

well if you really want a point system how about adding something to make you lose points for killing a teamie?

{LOD}WolfBear{:D} -my daddy was a pistol and I am a son of a gun-

[TheSniper]

How about loosing points when you run? That way the "pointfreaks" will think twice on rushing like some drugaddict looking for crack.:D

[Murphy]

TheSniper: How about not? Not all running is rushing, or fleeing. Moving from cover to cover rapidly, getting into position early, and other similar occurences are common uses of running. It would suck that moving about quickly cost you points, where you could camp the startpoint and be alright.

In general: Individual scores are nigh useless, more trouble than they are worth. Personal stats on hit percentages and the like could be useful. Perhaps a "close counts" sphere hit percentage as well for those intending to fire for cover, putting enemy heads down. That latter stat should be for non-explosive munitions only, I think.

Bah, I'm getting closer and closer to The_Fur's view on this as time goes on. Score, schmore.

[Nerf Herder]

I don't care about the score. I just play to have fun and have my team win. The problem with scores is other people can ruin my fun by playing for the score.

[{LOD}WolfBear]

Heck I agree I could really give a rat's fart in a whirlwind about a score to be honest, I am all about best death and having fun (not best kill mind you best death)

{LOD}WolfBear{:D} -my daddy was a pistol and I am a son of a gun-

[TheSniper]

Originally posted by Murphy
TheSniper: How about not? Not all running is rushing, or fleeing...

I guess you havent been playing much online lately. Because most people that plays INF now plays it like "DM" not "TDM". And "maybe" my idea would stop them from doing so, and start to play more as a team. :)

[Ebonite DPW]

here's my idea. Flame if you want, but it makes sence to me. Just have a point system where each player gets one (1) point for every round his or her team has won. Each player would lose one (1) point for the first and second TK he/she commits (to allow for team switches and the "happy tigger finger" syndrome) and lose ten (10) points for each TK after that in the same match. This way it becomes a "team" game to win the round, and chronic TeamKillers are easily identified. A separate column could be used to show kills for each player, though I would recommend it be a server option, not an automatic feature. Those who want to know how many they kill will just have to find a server that shows it.

If you want to get fancy, I have two more options. Both assume the preceding is implemented, and add that the server keeps track of kills for each player, but is not displaying them (optioned off). First, players with the same scores are listed in order of the most kills, so they know who has more kills in the same point bracket, but not how many. This would also eliminate "kill scouting" where people launch grenades blindly and check their score to see if they got anyone. The second option is to set the server to track kills but not display them, period. Set the client to have an option to display kills, so each individual player can decide whether to know their kills or not, and have the client ping the server for the information if the player does want to have that information.

In any case, points would be visible to everyone playing (making it easier to vote out TK'ers) and kills should only be displayed to teammates, except at the end of each match (the same way score is displayed now).

Suicides are questionable in my opinion. I do think they should be applied to your points, if at all, not your kills. Right now I feel they should not affect your point total at all, as they don't really affect your team unless you take out someone else in the process (i.e. grenade), in whick case the TK penalty applies. If you want to penalize players for suicides, a simple one (1) point loss should suffice, though the embarrassment of falling down the chasm or stepping on a mine and having to wait for your team to finish the round would be enough punishment for most people. And then there is the spot in Extreme Prejudice where you get stuck in the second floor of a building by the blue side. I'd rather suicide than wait for an enemy player to (maybe) find and kill me. I'd rather not face a point loss for my own stupidity.

Anyway, that's just my $.02, though due to the rate of inflation since I started writing this reply, that $.02 is now worth $.05.

[PDX]Ebonite

[Murphy]

TheSniper: I'm online plenty, considering the amount of free time I have available, which is admittedly small. However, I suggest that (1) try frequenting some other servers and (2) your suggestion won't do dick about those who rush around game.

In General: I tend to play on the SK servers, and either early evening or very late at night. At those times I tend to run into a fair number of SK folk, [L], and a few other clan folk as well. Perhaps it's a function of many of them being on Roger Wilco with one another, but I don't see as much grandstanding DM-rush about as I hear about on these message boards. Maybe I'm lucky, I don't know.

With the advent of EAS and more variety of game styles hosted by servers, I think this rush-about deathmatch epidemic will run it's course and die out.

[DredDamo]

Clanners don't generally use RW (or other voicecomms) on publics. Those are usually too random to do so. We do, however, try to play matches as if they were wars and in wars blind rushing will get you nowhere.

A lot of us are in a clan exactly because we want to focus on teamplay, not on lone ranger stuntwork :)

And I'm totally for

a) no score during the round to eliminate 'kill scoping' as mentioned before,
b) rewarding teamplay in manner described by ebonite

or eliminating the score altogether.

I'd like to see some stats tho', mainly accuracy and amount of 'ammo wasted' per player :) Also some sort of bulk comparison to see who's the multigun whore :P Just curiosity...but implementing any of that will lead people to think that accuracy = score, so...

There's never a perfect idea :)

[L]-Damodred

[Luminuis]

**** the whole point system for frags, how about you get a point for every match you survive? Oh wait, Camp-city.

[The_Fur]

I like Ebonites system, however I still say scrap kill counting alltogether. In order to get teamwork we need to force and attitude change not just change the scoring, as long as frags are counted people will keep playing for them and you will not have achieved anything.

[Pleuresaap]

i'd like to have a scoreboard with behind each name:
number of enemys killed
number of friendlys killed
HITPERCENTAGE i really want that

[[L]-Baston]

Originally posted by The_Fur
It's being changed to a system ala Crapper Strike, 1 kill 1 point. Ofcourse I would put the entire frag system trough the woodchipper, just be glad it isn't up to me.

Crapper strike - LOL...

Ultimately i dont like the way the points system works but a kill is a kill and valuing that kill seems in principle a good idea.

Perhaps it needs a tiny reworking... but i favour keeping it...

[HanD_of_DarKNesS]

For a scoring system, I say it simply displays amount of time ALIVE in game. It's not a "score' persay, but you aren't any good to your team if you're dead, right? Of course this system would probably promote some players to simply sit and hide just to get the best "score", and thus some combination of that time (which I still think should be displayed under any new scoring system), as well as points for kills or accuracy would be required.

This is probably the toughest issue for the game right now. There is no ideal system for a teamgame like INF. I've seen threads like this one many times in the past (especially on the old forum), and there were many good ideas, but nothing that would really work best in implementation.

[[L]the_Countess]

i whould like this system at all

it whould promote MASIVE "camping"
and whould slow the game down massively

there are not many games where i still live @ the end
not because i suck but because i take risks and rush in
i get a lot of killz but usualy dont live long

now tell me what is more usefull fo the team
a somebody that kills anywhere up to half the enamy team but is dead within a minut
or somebody that sits @ the back doing nothing

maybe a system where different weapons give a differnt amount of points
but then so you get around 2 or 3 points per kill no matter what weapon you use
(maybe add more for headshots)
this could be hard to balance right thou

(ps could you make give out a fix for the prone but befor 10th this monts? plz?
that way we can get it befor we have to fight the pronebug wh*re's SMA :) )

[Elite_Soldier]

... but how about if there was only the team score available, and a private tracker dictating who the best player in the match was? Or possibly you don't know how many frags you (or anyone else for that matter) have until the end of the round? That would work out ok I think.

The only problem you run into here, is people will still probably rush like mad to get MVP at the end.

Maybe there should only be a teamscore tally, and at the very end of the round YOU and YOU only would be able to see your statisitcs (accuracy, #of headshots, friendly fire kills, enemy kills etc.)

Speaking of which, (somewhat unrelated) does anyone think more points shoul be rewarded for people who kill others with inferior weaponry? For example a silent knife kill should reward the player much more than rushing in with an MP-5 and hosing down one guy...

[TheSniper]

Originally posted by [L]the_Countess


now tell me what is more usefull fo the team
a somebody that kills anywhere up to half the enamy team but is dead within a minut
or somebody that sits @ the back doing nothing


This is a fact and not something im making up all random to piss people off.

People that goes of "rushing" is doing more harm than anything good for the team. Not knowing where you have your teammates is the number one reason that there is so much teamkilling. And as long as there are rushers runing around there will never be any teamwork. They dont give a **** about the team and only play for their invidiual scores.

[[L]the_Countess]

about the kniff
good point

but about stats you can only see yourself
no i dont think thats a good idea

part of the fun of the game (and any other game)
is to see if your better then the rest
taking that away it whould be like put in a lot of hard work into someting without seing results

in this case the work is also fun but the point still remains

[TheSniper]

The teamscore shows the result not the invidiual players score.

[TheSniper]

Why is it so hard for people to figure out that this is a teamgame not some game to show off ur so called invidiual skills.

[Excelsiore]

Sorry for namecalling online today [L]the_Countess, but you did it as well :=)

Why are so many people deathly afraid of INF becoming a slow paced game? If you've ever been in the army you know that anything takes forever...

I agree with HoD. Survival needs to be rewarded more. Just because you kill more enemies than your enemy doesn't mean you've won the battle or the war.

[[L]the_Countess]

oo look its the pronebug whore :p

but seriusly
the reason i play this and not TO is 1ste its more realistic (less bullets kill)
but 2de there is a effecive weapon against campers (grande laucher)
this makes the game faster besides the maps being bigger then in TO


as for rushers not helping the team
ummmmm
i rush in and get passed the enamy lines
tell them where i am (depending on the map)
and then take another route to get behind the enamy

what could be more helpfull then somebody attacking the enamy from behind when your pinned down

and the TK's
thats my problem
i get tk-ed not the snipers
its a risk i am willing to take

[HanD_of_DarKNesS]

I don't see any advantage to "rushing" in the traditional sense of the word.

In maps like DM-INF-Chasm I rush, but do so as a unit. There will be 3 or 4 of us who rush for the top walkway. We move and work as a unit, and thus rarely suffer any casulties in doing so. This is a typical (and realistic) strategy, and translates well to most maps. This is how "rushing" should be done.

Rushing as an individual does little to actually help, when you encounter a unit like what I explained above, and the advantage of flanking the enemy to save your teammates is negligable to having your support right there with you.