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BlueSniper
5th Apr 2001, 05:28 PM
Out of all my video gaming years... I just learned about one year ago about a habit that I have always deemed the smart choice... Camping. WTF is wrong with it!? All those who play FPS's on consoles would know that camping is a smart thing to do. If you don't believe in camping, more power to ya, but don't bring your trouble on to me. Just because I like to survive AND kill at the same time doesent mean I'm a bad person. In real life, its often the snipers who walk away unharmed, and those who are in front line get smeared on the wall. You insult me because I dont want to be cleaned up with a sponge? how insane is that!? And annother thing. I dont know of ONE camper who stays in the same spot the entire game, how can that be considered camping!? to addon to that... if you know there is a camper, WHY THE HECK DO YOU RUN OUT IN TO THEIR AIM!? its obvios that they're staying there. If you dont like campers, fight fire with fire. if you stay in one spot, then the other guy will (most likely) get bored and move around.
Now I'm off the subject... What I would like to have happen is less name calling and kicking of campers. Just because you won't camp doesent mean the others can't!

give me feedback

RogueLeader
5th Apr 2001, 05:30 PM
Amen, brotha`

Mason
5th Apr 2001, 05:39 PM
Agreed. I absolutely hate it when you are playing a match and someone starts complaining about those damn "camping snipers"! DUH! You wouldn't be a very good sniper if you were running around full-bore now, would you? With this being a 'military sim', camping(I prefer the term SNIPING) is not only legitimate, but smart. Minimize your own exposure while taking out the enemy. For Gods' sake guys, that's just sound military strategy! Gee, let's see how effective our military would be if everyone tried rushing the enemy, bunny-hopping around like a madman. This isn't Doom, Quake, or even UT..tactics made popular by these games are just going to get you dead when playing Infiltration. Oh, by the way, feel free to use the grenade launcher to 'rocket jump'.

ThunderChunky
5th Apr 2001, 05:54 PM
My favorite time being called a camper was as such:

It was in Peru, and at one of the outlets into the main battle area. I was following about three of my team. All of a sudden, they all get mowed down by gunfire. Naturally, I hang back to avoid the same fate. All of a sudden, a guy comes blazing about the corner, and I plug him. And he calls me a camper...

Oh well.

RogueLeader
5th Apr 2001, 06:24 PM
Victim: "youre a ****in camper rl"

Me: "maybe you shouldn't have randomly blasting a shotgun everywhere you looked. that draws my attention you know"

"dude what do you think this is quake" [yes this is my victim saying that]

"thanks you saved me the trouble of asking that"

"**** you dude"

Victim leaves.

Sometimes I think CS and Inf must be compatible and CS'ers are connecting to Inf servers...

St0rmcaller
5th Apr 2001, 06:37 PM
This is NOT! We are out to kill each other. I want what he wants...for the streets to flow with the blood of the non-believers!

I hate campers...when I die to sniper fire. But the feeling fades after I realize he was just doing his job. I choose not to snipe (95% of the time), but that is my choice. No one elses. Of course, I have laid ambushes with my clanmates, and been accused of camping. Oh, fukking well. We can all walk away from the keyboard anytime we like.

WARNING! Flagrant recruitment attempt to follow!

BTW...While we are talking about it...AFA needs a good sniper/camper. Please, military or former military only!
dbindert@charter.net

ArbSkynxnex
5th Apr 2001, 06:47 PM
Ok, I figured out the different types of camping, not all are bad either, I am a propponent of camping if its done right. They are as follows:
Camping to kill, aka the ambush - this involves you waiting on a route that the enemy likes to follow and waxing them when they run by, waiting is ok but your position may need to be moved if they get wise. verdict on this method, innocent.

Base camping - Normally the lower life forms base camp. Basically you hide in your base and don't move, even if the enemy never comes near your spawn point. Justifiable when on some maps, normally when they have to run past your spawn point.

Sniping - Some times confused as camping to hide. Basically you find a nice dark safe place with a good field of view a ways away from the fire fights and pick off the unfortunate vicitm from halfway across the map. Iritiating as hell when you can't find the guy, but its a good method.

Camping to hide - This is the lowest form of camping possible. Offender runs from fights, hides in the darkest places and lets the enemy runs by. They are out to make the match last as long as possible and to piss everyone off. May or may not fight if they are the last person on their team.

AFK - Away from keyboard, just shoot him and save everyone else the time of trying to find them. :)

RogueLeader
5th Apr 2001, 06:56 PM
The second to last of those is what I really consider a camper. Those lousy ll4m4s that hide until the last player countdown runs out. I also hate it when there are only 2 people left and one of them still sticks to one sniper spot. Sniping is fine, but once the match is reduced to only a few people, you need to get it over with.

Tuttle INF
5th Apr 2001, 07:06 PM
Amen to everything in this thread!

St0rmcaller
5th Apr 2001, 07:17 PM
Actually, when there are only 2 people left on a map...1 of them SHOULD stop running around. Statistically speaking, the odds of 2 people wandering around a map at the same time trying to find eachother are much greater than 1 staying put and the other trying to find him. We should play hide and seek, not seek and seek!

Of course, that requires cooperation with the enemy.

poaw
5th Apr 2001, 08:37 PM
So how do you decide who hides and who seeks?

Last PLayer countdown Started (180 seconds)

Player 1: So we're the last ones left.
Player 2: Yeah
Player 1: ok who hides and who seeks
Player 2: I'll seek
Player 1: Ok



Last Player countdown Started (180 seconds)
Player 1: Oh ****
player 1 (hides)
Player 2 (hides)

Beagle_One
5th Apr 2001, 08:39 PM
As unfortunate as it is, and stranger than RL, there are people who CHOOSE to play INF and still become "Apam"(from Private Ryan).

In RL war, I would understand that there would be people who just wanna survive by hiding. Better alive than dead, as some say. But playing INF is a whole different thing. Although INF is pretty close to RL than most other games, you can still just turn away from your computer and choose NOT to play. But they somehow decide to play but chiken out once out there in the field.

Notice I'm NOT talking about snipers or ambushers. I am talking about "plain campers" who just sit around doing nothing. I don't understand why they play INF if they don't wanna fight. One of the mysteries in this so-called RL, I guess...

BlueSniper
5th Apr 2001, 10:47 PM
I love sniping so much, I almost live for it. Im glad that I'm not the only one.

:::sniff::: <---- just kidding!

ArbSkynxnex
5th Apr 2001, 11:14 PM
We have the tents, we have the wieners, all we need now is a fire to roast the wieners. :)

AtomicAxis
5th Apr 2001, 11:16 PM
The problem is that the definition of who is actually camping is different for everyone.

I know of people who think that if you stop moving for like a 10th of a second then you are camping. Other people think that you have to stay in the same spot for 10 mins b4 you are considered camping.

Me, I dont care. As was said previously if you know there camping then do something about it. If you dont and you die then they did there objective.

However saying that is not going to stop me from saying "You damn campers, I hate you and your camping ways" but if you see me out there doing it please dont be offended because its only cuz you shot me. If I shot you then there wouldnt be a problem. I seem to have a big problem with dying. For some reason I dont like (you think I would be used to it by now). :)

Camping in the old quake and quake 2 days was a problem but now it is part of a game (what use is a snipers rifle at close range against a shotty).

Ill prolly get flamed for this but at the end of the day it is only a game and in a few minutes you are going to respawn anyway so why get angry about it? (unless its funk$tylz who shot ya cuz that is just plain embarrasing when that happens).

Hey funk, still coming to Byron? You better not pike on me? :)

I_ABuGa
6th Apr 2001, 02:41 AM
Interesting discussion, just a reminder keep it clean guys as this is a touchy subject.

Now, someone tell me whut an APAM is.

SoSilencer
6th Apr 2001, 05:44 AM
One time on Cuban Dawn my teammates all rushed forward and all but a few died. Round ends one way or another and the new one they... do the exact same thing, getting cut down exactly like last game. After telling them to slow it down and work as a team, they do it again and all die. By the 4th or 5th game of doing this I simply run away from my team, knowing they will all be killed and replaced with enemy soldiers.

I just went back into the corner by the dock and sat there, watching the entrances to the water area and sniper hill. Of course my teammates were furious with me for running back to camp instead of rushing forward with them to die. I just pointed out that their strategy obviously isn't working. This of course upset them even more because as Mark Twain said...

"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example."

So I'm sitting there with my robar when one of the enemies (if I'm not mistaken their entire team was still alive) goes up onto sniper hill. I kill him just in time for a second to run up. So I sit there, still being told to stop camping and go fight. One by one the enemy team goes up onto sniper hill and one by one I shoot them.

It was a while ago so I don't really remember how everything happened but I'm pretty sure that after I won the game they stopped complaining.

ArbSkynxnex
6th Apr 2001, 06:19 AM
You forgot the moral, we need a moral. :D

CoffeyCan
6th Apr 2001, 09:47 AM
I have very unpopular thoughts when it comes to snipers and 'camping' in INF, so Ill keep it to myself.

BUT, I think overall well see a change when the new game modes are intorduced, shifting gameplay from TDM to more assault style should help.
CC

RogueLeader
6th Apr 2001, 09:56 AM
Stop tomrenting us with these little tidbits of information! You're so cruel!!!

/me wants dynamic games modes!

CoffeyCan
6th Apr 2001, 11:03 AM
No, no its not like that. I dont know anymore than the next guy, its simply that if you have actual objectives other than wiping out the other team itll change things up.
CC

Kuroshio Apocal
6th Apr 2001, 11:28 AM
It's Upham, not Apam. Corporal Upham from the Signal Corps.

Oli Dude
6th Apr 2001, 12:09 PM
Okay here we go again......one of the most famous subjects since the dawn of time.

My first relistic mod i ever played was AQ2 if u dont know what hat is then well get a life.

I have been playing fps since doom.

Now lets see here.....everyone likes the words for this mod realism and relistic.

So lets work along these lines.

Realife people dont get up and go CHARGE!!!!

"Look at me im trying to brk the world record for meeting the ememy quickly as possible"

Im sorry but realistic mods require realistic tactics.

So yes i do camp but if i see an enemy run past and i miss in my camped position i will get up and run after him too shoot him in the back :-)

A freind of mine NO BULL is a ex member of the SAS

He's the one who got me started on this mod.

He plays using the training he has. He will find the darkest place of the map possible with only one direction of fire possible.

He will use a loadout of an RC50 and mp5 silenced. He never runs - always in crouch if camped then in prone.

Every time he plays he cleans house and comes out alive.

So I thinks that sums it up.

U want realism

Realism = camping and a very slow game dont like it then play normal UT or Q2 DM

Would of Said Q3 but it sux

Razorflower
6th Apr 2001, 05:39 PM
... I'm a died in the wool camper myself. I.e., conceal, fire, move, conceal, fire, move.

I do NOT dig peeps who sit inna hole all game long and hold up the game. Sides, it makes sense. You fire, you expose yourself. So. Fire, move, conceal. Fire.

My definition of camping.

Razorflower

St0rmcaller
6th Apr 2001, 05:43 PM
And no, this strategy does not work well in INF.
But, there is an old Marine Corps saying about the battlefield:

"The safest place on the battlefield is exactly where the enemy is at."

I've been trying to prove this, but to no avail. For some strange reason, it requires TEAMWORK to remove a sniper.

Beagle_One
7th Apr 2001, 10:37 AM
Thanks Kuroshio Apocal for correcting my spelling for the name "Upham". I had absolutely no idea how his name spelled:D

Kuroshio Apocal
8th Apr 2001, 01:10 AM
Hehe. I didn't realize I actually posted that. 8+ hours straight of CS/DoD/FLF/FA/UT/INF/RS can do that to you :).

But before you knock Upham too hard, remember that in the end, he stood up and single-handedly took 7 or 8 Germans out of the fight and only used one round. Now that took cajones. Real huevos grande.

:)

Beagle_One
8th Apr 2001, 02:24 AM
True. I forgot about that part.
While on Private Ryan subject, I think it would be cool if you could throw your gun or helmet(or whatever you are holding at the time) at the enemy right in front of you if you run out of ammo, just like in the movie. You almost never run out of ammo in INF but I thought it'd be cool just to be able to do such.:D

St0rmcaller
8th Apr 2001, 02:52 AM
Is that good enough? :)

DeRailer
8th Apr 2001, 03:12 AM
I snipe 50% of the time. I got got my victims 50% of the time as well. I was BACKSTABBED 50% of the time :D

Snipers are OK with me Since most of the maps in INF have plenty of covers. Some good examples are Sicily and Kosovo. Both maps have a LOT of covers and AHEM a LOT of Location to snipe. If i got sniped down, it just means i got careless that round.
If the campers really drag the timer to 0, well... we will get them next round :)

But have anyone consider the disadvantages of being a sniper? Snipers will be aiming though that scope 90% of the time, and not knowing if anyone is creeping to their back to Knife em'.

Sicily Night- This is definetly a nightmare for everyone, including snipers. Snipers could go inside an apartment, turn off the lights and remain undetected, bad news for the victims. But their vision have been "limited" to the scope, and are in a extremely tense situation themselves. :D

The only drawback currently is the leaning system being disabled, which makes it difficult to to check for snipers before proceding to another area. But it will be fixed very soon so No worries.

! question: Once Leaning is brought back online. Will the snipers feel a "strain" on their waist after leaning for a LONG time, after all they are carrying quite a load.
(Maybe like after leaning for a while they have to to stretch their muscles :D before leaning again.)

EDIT: fixing smilies :D

Beagle_One
8th Apr 2001, 03:33 AM
Yes, you can throw your weapons. But what I meant was to throw your weapon AT SOMEONE so that you can stop him even for a second to give you a slight chance of fleeing the scene unharmed. You see what I mean? Have you seen Saving Private Ryan, and remember when this guy and his enemy run out of ammo and throw their guns and helmets at each other?? I thought that was so cool.:)

St0rmcaller
9th Apr 2001, 12:37 AM
However I was thinking of the old black and white Superman TV show. The bad guy has superman in a corner and opens up with his gun. Superman just stands there as the bullets bounce of his chest. When the bad guy's gun is empty, he follows typical bad guy doctrine, and throws the gun at him. And what does superman do? He ducks. There must be something inherently destructive about a thrown empty firearm, if even the mighty superman is afraid of it.

Am I the only one who ever noticed this? Or am I just plain ol' odd? :L

-=TALON=-
11th Apr 2001, 08:30 AM
I am always accused of being a camper. If I find a nice sniping position and sit there waiting for prey I am constantly be antagonised "Stop Camping and MOVE!" by my own team mates who are already dead [ironic isn't it :)]. Being ex-military myself I was a member of a security alert team. We learned that stealth and readiniess wins wars. Not every body run to the middle of the map and do a "showdown at high noon kinda thing". That is lame. Seal teams and special forces consider the job done right if the objective was obtained with-out being spotted or fired upon. My thoughts on the subject is if you run out in the open in a war... You Deserve that .50 cal slug that just went through your chest.

Beagle_One
11th Apr 2001, 09:26 AM
I think the problem is that too many people have played and enjoyed Quake and CS, and they want to bring the fast-paced action into INF as well. And there are those who truly love to play INF in realistic manner i.e. cherishing your life as if it is real. Those two styles of gaming don't belong in the same field.

What I could suggest here is that since there are number of people who wish to play INF as if it's CS or Quake, as well as those who wish to play INF in a more realistic manner, there should be separate servers for each group.
That way, if you are out of anyone's sight for the whole duration of the match like any good snipers should be in "Real-INF" server, you are feared as a great sniper instead of being called a "camper".
And those CSers and Quakers and bunnyhoppers can have their own frenzies and shooting sprees in their "Unreal-INF" server.:D

Then everybody will be happy.:)

Mason
11th Apr 2001, 03:58 PM
For all I care, those individuals can re-install Inf 2.75 then bunnyhop and frag 'till their heart's content. I just really wish they would learn that there is more to strategy than running headlong into the fray and then complaining that the person smart enough not to do what they did is a camper. Frankly, it's getting real old and real annoying. Go play SF or TO if that's what you want.