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:)
1st Feb 2001, 03:51 AM
i wonder if its possible for u2 to have some type of random level generator

like diablo had every time you played the game the maps had a difrent lay out


i dont think it would be impossible to do either there would just have to be alot of prefabed pieces and a code tellin the comp to put flap a into slot a :)

it would really make the best of the best stand out no more being able to know the maps like the back of your hand :)


you could probably do it with single player but it would be way harder then to do it for a dm map

what do you guys think

Uncle Leo
1st Feb 2001, 04:03 AM
Fractally generated planets.... Throwing up mountains and laying out cities according to some general rules.
It would be great for making HUGE maps. Larger than a few level designers could manually turn out.

slarioux
1st Feb 2001, 05:56 AM
Would be very, very hard... For example, how do you want to make an decent DM level? Logica rulez, and to implement that in a generator.... I think you should write down everything you think while making a level, so u know what to expect.

I dont have it anymore, but i had this funny (fake) pic of a level generator for Quake 3. It had four options.
1) What kind of environment (Gothic, Future like)
2) How many jumppads
3) How many times a minutes do bots suicide? (minimun is 5)
4) What part do the bots use (only one part), upper, lower, or middle.

So that kind of levels would you get i'm afraid

odie
1st Feb 2001, 08:26 AM
Believe it or not, I have actually had some success with random level design. However, there are two drawbacks that I can think of right away ...

1) I've tried using both prefab "pieces" that modularly fit together, as well as maze-like squarish geometry derived from lots of numbers. The prefab thing is just that ..... PREFAB. Once you've seen a certain setup more than once, it begins to have a prefab feel. And as far as generating squarish, maze-like levels that are purely random, they are neat, but boring.

2) I've written a several programs that work together to create random (or sorta random) maps. The problem is that the maps are in the form of T3D files. Once they have been generated, I still have to import them into the editor so I can "build the geometry" and save them as a UNR map file. There does not seem to be any useful way for a T3D designer to automate the whole process.

While reading about the new Doom game that is planned, John Carmack mentioned that the new 3D engine will rely on PC horsepower so that maps do not have to build a math tree ahead of time. This means that maps will be generally dynamic, paving the road for things like destroyable architecture, etc. If Unreal 2's new engine is re-written in such a way, random level generation may be possible. Of course, the new problem would be that all old maps would no longer be compatible !

slarioux
1st Feb 2001, 09:54 AM
Oh yes, i believe u on yer word :)

Are old UT levels going to fit in the new game? If that is the only compatibility problem, i think you can overlook it.

Indeed, after a while the levels become boring. I dont know how u did it, but rooms and hallways are not enough. After a while, you've seen em all :(. I also think it shouldnt be too random. If it is too random, it also takes a lot of time to generate it. Then there could be problems with bots (which i dont expect). Also, did u have proper lightning? And, the weapons placed in your level?


Yes, destroyable architecture would be very cool, but you shouldnt make to much terrain that can be broken down. As is now, the levels are cut out of a large block of massive stuff. With this you can be sure that you won't shoot a hole in your level. So, it should be possible to give a player the option to shoot right to walls, and shoot whole tunnels underground to the enemy :):).The setback is the lightning, because the tunnels would be very dark if there is no proper lightning.

If you could destroy the whole level, then it would be very boring, because you could just blow out the walls, and make a level one big hole ;)

:)
2nd Feb 2001, 04:10 AM
hmm

i think the way to get past the blocky maze look would be to use 2d shapes that can be extruded and arrayed much like the 2d shape editor does in ued

as for lighting there would have to be a high ambiant light with lights placed at points of intrest such as randomly created decorations and pickups

and for textures they would just have to be so that all the surfaces are labled (wall floor pillar etc.) and it could be givein a texture from the aproaite catagory


i think this could be done and done so the levels would be neat to play

but what do i know im just a face

slarioux
2nd Feb 2001, 09:16 AM
yes, just a face :-)

But not all the floor textures fit next to eachother. You dont want a brickwall next to a some grey wal with red stripes :)

:)
2nd Feb 2001, 02:04 PM
that wouldnt be much of a problem you would just have to lable what textures will work with eachother maybe have sevral packs where all the textures in each pack will work with each other and texture alignment wouldnt be a problem it could be done the same way its done in the editor


sure load times could be a few mins but there could be a waiting room type thing like in unreal 1 during level changes

it will probably be a few years befor we see anything like this but i think it will surely be the future of fps games

slarioux
3rd Feb 2001, 02:31 AM
But it should have a option to save those randoms, so you can save the very cool ones.

Also, you should try to make it '3D', so you could go up and down ladders and have multiple floors. Also outdoor rooms should be available, so you would need a skybox

Kail
3rd Feb 2001, 10:44 AM
As far as I know Unreal 2 will consist of a single player campaign. I'm not even sure if they will include multiplayer gameplay since UT2 (aka Unreal Warfare) will be released at approx the same time.
The Unreal series has been split into a SP and a MP fraction. That's good I believe since then we can have the best from both worlds.