How do you make a sheet that isn't "standard size"?

[Salmoneus]

Cryptic subject? Ok.

I want to make a vertical sheet (a window) that is 256 high and that covers the side of a triangle that is 256 wide and 128 high. Do you get me? That makes approx. 286.216701 ... and that will not be easy to make in the sheet builder........

I guess vertex editing will do the trick? or?
Then I WANT A TUTORIAL FOR VERTEX EDITING! :)

Help me!


/Salmoneus

[Jenkins]

yeah, eh, vertex editing should be the key

Jenkins

[Zaphrod]

What you are trying to do cant be done the way you think you can do it. The sheet brush is only for portals.

What you need to do is make a cube 128 high 256wide and the thickness (or less) of the wall that you want it placed in.

Now place it so it completely blocks the hole and parts of it are inside the walls. Make sure it is lined up so that the thichness is completly inside the wall, now deintersect it.

It should be the exact size of the hole now but that is no good because it wont look right at the edges, you will be able to see outside of the map to the GRID.

Now what you want to do is move it up 1 unit and deintersect again, then move it down 2 spaces and deintersect then move it back to the original place. Now you should have small gaps between the window and the wall (if you were making a square window you would also have to move it sideways 1 space in each direction but the triangle should be right now).

Now add the brush as either a solid if you want it to block the players or semisolid if you dont care whether it does or not (with semisolid it may or may not have some wholes but but it doesnt add to the BSP so it saves on resources and may make the map less laggy).

ok now you may or may not notice that the edges where it meets the wall are the texture of the wall instead of the Glass texture so now click on the front of the Glass brush to select that surface and then right click it for the menu options and select surfaces matching brush. Now , if you have the Glass texture selected in the texture browser, right click the surface in the 3D view (any one that is selected) and apply texture.

Now the whole window uses the Glass texture but it is probably not transparent so now make sure all the surfaces of the window are still selected and right click and go to surface properties and in FLAGS select transparent.

You should now have a nice window.

I dont know if thats the recommended way to do it but it works for me without having to try to use the clip brush and try to get it right.

[Slick_Willy]

What you are trying to do cant be done the way you think you can do it. The sheet brush is only for portals.

I'm not sure what you are talking about here. The sheet brush can be used for whatever you want. You can make a sheet and use the regular add button or the custom brush button and add it as semi-solid or non-solid. It is only a portal if portal is checked off when you add it. How do you think people are doing sheet flames for torches, masked decorations like cob webs, moss ,etc.

Anyway, the sheet builder only allows for a 4 sided sheet. If you need a 3 sided sheet or one with more than 4 sides then you use the 2d editor. Draw your shape in the 2d editor and then extrude as sheet

[Zaphrod]

Yea, your right about that but what I meant was its not structural in any way, no matter how you add it to the world its never gonna block players and a window should unless its supposed to be a "Secret" or something.

I havent looked at every map but I have never seen a sheet used for a window. they are always made with the cube brush and if they need to define a zone then a portal is added in front of it.

Anyway thanks for making the point clear.

[tarquin]

I had a good look at the original Epic maps when I wanted to make windows -- the way they do it is with TWO brushes. The exact same technique is used for grille-type walkways like in DM-Conveyor or DM-Turbine.

There's a sheet brush, set to 2-sided, non-solid.
This has a glass texture, and is set to translucent, or a grille and set to masked. You can set it to zone portal too if you like.
The second brush is semi-solid and invisible -- use the 'invisible collision hull' setting in the special builder. This should have the same cross-section as the sheet (so you can make them from the same 2D shape), but be 8 or 16 units thick. The two brushes are positioned so the sheet is exactly in the middle of the semisolid's thickness.
This is VERY hard to see in the editor if you explore a map, as most of them use a standard texture on the semisolid, so in the editor you can't see the sheet inside. Move VERY slowly in the 3D view and once the camera is INSIDE the semisolid, you'll see the glass/grille.
DM-conveyor is different, he uses the same texture on both, so you can see through the semi solid. Look at the walkways in the room with the U-damage.

For your triangular window -- make it with the regular cube and sheet brushes, to a height that mathces your triangle. Then go to a side-on view and use the vertex editor to drag the top of your 2 brushes so they slope against your triangle.

[Zaphrod]

Hey Tarquin,

I tried to figure out what they were doing and I wound up doing it exactly the opposite way except I always make the cube brush solid because there are supposed to be Holes in semi solid brushes sometimes and I thought they wouldnt always block players.

Have you done it the other way but with the window on the floor and does it still work?

[Salmoneus]

Good. But the window I try to make is not touching any walls, just the floor. It's an octagonal platform that I want to put glass "walls" on. The horizontal and vertical parts are easy, just add an invisible solid and a translucent glass sheet. But it's the size of the 45 degree parts that bothers me. I want the height to be, say 256, but the width of it will be squareroot(128*128 + 128*128), a triangle with vertical and horizontal sides of 128. You follow me? How do you make that sheet?

And also, why does the window has to be made up of an "invisible collision hull". Why not just an added box with invisible surfaces?

/Salmoneus

[B]

Ehh I may sound really stupid now but can't this be done with te 2d shape editor?

[Salmoneus]

Yes, and no. In this case, with a 128x128 triangle side, it can be done, but the height will not be EXACTLY 256. If my triangle side (the base of the window) would be for example 128x256, I can't rotate the @£$%& mover so that it is aligned with the floor! Try it, and tell me how to do that!

And again: Is there any good tutorials on vertex editing? I just don't get it! (maybe I'm stupid?)



/Salmoneus


ps. YOU WANT THIS MAP! YES YOU DO!!!
http://w1.243.telia.com/~u24311300/DM-SSAB.zip
ds.

[B]

ok it tried it but you're right it doens align wih the floor

damn! wish I could help....

AND ow yeah if you find some vertex editing tuts let me know cause it's giving me a s

plitting headake.....

[tarquin]

Windows or grilles made with a sheet inside a semi-solid work fine as floors.

Re: vertex editing. Make the sheet the right height and width. Now switch to a view where it is side-on (cue ascii art)
|
|
|

Now vertex edit the top like this:
select the brush.
click on the vertex edit tool (Im assuming you have 432)
select the top vertex -- but with vertex editing the only way to select is by dragging a selection box. hold down CTRL and ALT, click in nothingness near to the top of the sheet, drag to enclose the top vertex and release. You have now selected both the top vertices; if you activate another viewport you will see this. Now click on the vertex in the side view and drag in to one side:
\
\
\
you should see this. Let go when it's at the right place.

If your brush needs to go diagonally when looking in the top view, now is the time to rotate it.

Hope this helps.