Interesting thread concerning referees in clan matches

  • Two Factor Authentication is now available on BeyondUnreal Forums. To configure it, visit your Profile and look for the "Two Step Verification" option on the left side. We can send codes via email (may be slower) or you can set up any TOTP Authenticator app on your phone (Authy, Google Authenticator, etc) to deliver codes. It is highly recommended that you configure this to keep your account safe.
E

Entropica{KS}

nepenthe's temporary body
Jul 19, 2000
181
0
0
Hello all you good good people

With all the talk of those things we would never do in actual clan competition, and all those things we consider cheating or cheap, I was wondering if someone might think about having some rules in place for these kinds of activities in official clan matches (particularly the high ranking showdowns and cups and championships). Let me explain

First let me define terms by making a couple analogies.


**Outright cheating in the NFL: bringing a knife to the dog pile, using a car instead of your feet, having 18 men on the field instead of 11, using two footballs at once.
**Outright cheating in UT: aimbots, using server admin priveledges to cheat, skin cheats, using extra players, etc.
These things are *ahem* obviously blatantly cheap and completely against the rules of competition

**A penalty in the NFL: offsides, offensive holding, roughing the kicker, interference, etc.
**A penalty in UT:?

What I propose is we have two or three spectating "referees" out there watching clan matches. Obviously they can't catch everything, but neither do NFL officials, do they? Regardless, such things would be discouraged by the mere presence. Penalties of some kind (point losses, penalty boxes, etc.) could be assessed for spawn sniping, piston camping (maybe have a 3 second violation for this, a la the NBA, because just using that as a defense while being chased shouldn't be totally disallowed), using the Redeemer to toss the flag you were carrying all the way to the other base, maybe even "telepunting".

I'm sure you folks can think of many more examples of where rules might help balance the game. What do you think of this idea? I invite you to call it crap. In general, though, and in the future as these games become mainstream and wildly popular, do you think rules beyond the blatant cheats would be beneficial? I'm not talking about having officials watching your average Joe clanmatch next week... But for the big ones, and for the future?

Thanks for any feedback!

Entropica{KS}
 
G

gramps

New Member
Mar 27, 2000
1,574
0
0
www.crookram.net
a good idea, but...

first, this will only work if everybody respects the referee's authority. if even one person does not acknowledge the ref the whole point of a referee being there is moot.

the reasons you point out (spawn camping, skin cheating etc) are all very valid, but you're also talking about official clan matches. since i'm not in a clan i can't really say, but i seriously doubt these kind of things happen in official matches. or do they? i just can't imagine clan C or Ci using skin cheats (ok, there are lots of other clans, but how many play in official leagues? plz correct me if i'm wrong here.)

furthermore, who is to say what's lame and what's not? ok, i think we can all agree spawn camping is lame, but what about piston camping? or using the redeemer to thrust the flag to your own base? or even defending the base with all your team members? where do you set the limit? not that i approve (or radically disapprove) of these kinds of gameplay, but there are bound to be people who consider this valid tactics.

so, although i think the principle is very good, i'm afraid it'll only come in handy on public servers, and who'll listen to a ref there? most players don't even listen to each other.

please don't take this as a dis Entropica, i really think it's a good idea, i just don't think it'll work out. :(
 
SU3000

SU3000

Bringer of Fear and 0wnage
Jun 10, 2000
2,043
0
36
The Netherlands
www.carpeimperium.com
Penalties in UT could be:
-A flag cap (unhindered by defense).
-bonus frags (offender gets fragged x times depending on lameness).
-disqualification, if the act is one of extreme lameness.

clans would have to agree on the ref, though, or the admin of the league should appoint one.
And there should be a list of lame acts and penalties, of course.
 
A

Arkive

New Member
May 10, 2000
272
0
0
members.home.com
I don't see this happening. For one thing, most of the things you list are going to be agreed on by some clans and disagreed on by others. Not only will there now be arguments over what servers and map(s) are fair, now people will argue over what discretionary rules to implement. Also, I think the big thing is that there's no way to stop the clock in a UT game, and when there's 3 minutes left in play and your team is down by a cap, do you really wanna be screwing around administering punishment when that time could be better spent trying to even the score? You'll have teams intentionally taking penalties to try and burn the clock. I think your idea is great, but there's really no way to properly officiate it yet, unless someone wants to write a mod that would support a referee type system, in which case I'm all for it (assuming all clans could come to some sort of consensus about what rules should be used).

Jeff
 
D

darklite

New Member
Apr 3, 2000
1,143
0
0
42
well, I'm glad I can say that even though my experience in clan matches are lacking, I've never had to go up against a clan who cheated.

now.. this might be a good idea, but I doubt a very realistic one. no doubt each ladder would want to appoint their own referees and not let the clans appoint them. the manpower for that would have to be tremendous.

I also think UT makes less sense than football for a referee. people will be all over the place in a CTF match while the football players are in basically the same place. that would make me think there would need to be a few referees per match. off the top of my head, four would probably be the best number.. two keep an eye on each team's defense, and another two to keep an eye on each team's offense. I'm probably in a fairly small ladder compared to most popular CTF weapons ladders, but theres still around 40 clans in the ladder, which equates to a theoretical 20 matches a week. the number in most weapons CTF ladders are probably substancially higher, but I'm not sure how much because I've never looked

anyway, back to my main point.. unless the ladder in question wants to appoint four people for all the matches.. they'd have to have probably around 20-30 people for referees atleast I would think.. and that's just for that small 40 clan ladder. they would also need referees for all their other ladders.. I wouldn't doubt that many of the popular ladders (OGL, TeamPlay, PG) could easily break 100 referees.. if not closer to 200..
 
hal

hal

Dictator
Staff member
Nov 24, 1998
21,409
19
38
54
------->
www.beyondunreal.com
I say, play the game as Epic set it up. Agree beforehand on cheese...with the penalty being loss of respect and honourability.

Referees and the like, make the game childish and silly. Besides, what neutral, globally accepted party would be able to police each game?
 
DragonAsh

DragonAsh

Hentai-like
Feb 10, 2000
1,599
0
0
( i did not read any of the responses. Sorry If i repeat something ;p)

Well, in the TP UTI2, and admin must be present.
And if pregame rules are agreed upon, like a no cheese rule, then the admin enforces it.
 
WAnk

WAnk

PH34R TH3 WAnk??<br><img src="http://markwsucks.ho
Mar 17, 2000
2,307
0
0
43
Seattle
www.wanked.net
no way with the penalties

i love the idea of 1 ref (any more might hinder servers ability to perform) in important matches. but from experience, it is hard enough to find an admin, let alone get him in the server with you :p as for enforcing penalties and things like that, i think it ruins professional sports to a degree. if you have an admin stopping ****, it will detract from gameplay and the enjoyabilty of the match, just like it does in football and basketball, etc. an admin to make sure no one turns on god mode and to write a recap is a great thing, but beyond that is a bad idea, in my opinion
 
The_Inflictor

The_Inflictor

Honest and unmerciful
Mar 25, 2000
2,433
0
0
Midlands
Interesting, but how does an admin enforce the laws set out (regarding penalties/enforced flag caps etc)?

IMO, it will just be complicating the situation with the possibility of causing more bitchiness.

League matches aren't necessarily that bad, the problem is more on public servers. If a team/player acts lame, the duty of an admin should be to say that the offender/s should default the match or suspend the offending players.

Just my tuppence.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom