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View Full Version : Deployables and Techs?


RedKerensky
24th Jul 2005, 02:56 PM
Just to start the thread, this is part questioning 'Is this a bug?' and part Suggestion.

I donno if its just me, but the deployable tracking seems very slow. Ontop of the other weaknesses that deployables have, including their reliance on hard-to-defend generators, that they blow up easily, and their very narrow field of vision. I have seen people dart in a heavily fortified room, grab an artifact, and dart out before the turrets even activate. The only time ive seen turrets made successful kills is when either the target is not moving very fast, or when the target happens to stand still, or meander slowly into a turret's field of vision. All of these from rocket turrets. Luckshots do not count.

As for Techs, I can understand the assault rifle and shotgun for self-defense against the occasional infantry, but, why the grenade launcher? As a Tech I do not expect to go up against tanks or other vehicles regularly. Techs/engineers as far as I know are supposed to create and maintain defense grids of turrets, energy barriers, sensors, and resupply stations, not fight.

Given, im not sure how willing the Dev team is when it comes to straying from standard UT2: XMP. Nor have I ever played UT2: XMP and therefore cannot compare the two. But these are my thoughts and observations.

shoptroll
24th Jul 2005, 10:38 PM
Not totally sure if this really is a bug report, but here's my reply to your question.

The tech has a grenade launcher like all the other classes in XMP. Each class is provided with a launcher that specifically launchers 2 of the 6 grenade types from Unreal 2.

The main justification for the EMP 'nades is that the tech needs a way to deal with vehicles and deployables. Each class has a method of dealing with these. Ranger uses the Shock Lance alternate, Gunner the Rocket Launcher (aka. Shark) and the tech has EMP 'nades.

The gas grenades I believe are for mid range combat. The tech's other two weapons (the Assault Rifle and Shotgun) are less effective at longer ranges (Shotgun for projectile spread, AR for cone of fire for its range). The gas grenade can provide a much needed punch in a concentrated area. Also, in U2XMP grenades were able to be fired off noticeably faster than the current UTXMP implementation, which allowed the gas grenades to be used to cover an area providing extra defense at critical times. However, the strength of the gas has been a sticky subject for quite a while I believe.

Hope that helps.

...andrelax
25th Jul 2005, 04:24 AM
good answer

Naib
25th Jul 2005, 04:45 AM
For the turrets the trick is to place them so someone runs towards or away from them. That way they don't need to do so much tracking, and will hit a lot more often.

Rocket turrets are not as useful as auto turrets, but when you do use them try to find somewhere high up to place them so they make the best use of splash damage.

And remember when using deployables to defend the node, they are not there to kill someone, but to give you more time to take out the attacker yourself.

MadMan2k
25th Jul 2005, 07:47 AM
the best place for autoturrets is somehwere in a dark edge, which is at max range from the target - this way you cant see them and cant hear them and unless you know where there, you will be killed each time you try to hunt them down.

RedKerensky
25th Jul 2005, 01:36 PM
I think I worded what I wanted to say wrong, its that the response time of the turrets are crap. Problem is, I set up tons of turrets in the corners, forcefields practically everywhere in a room with my team's artifact dropoff zone. It was a large room, but not collossal.

Problem is, ive had enemies just dart right in, steal an artifact, and dart right out without any of the turrets situated in the corners responding. I wouldnt mind if he had to kill the deployables first, or if the deployable deathtrap (around 5-10 auto and rocket turrets) fired on (and probably butchered) him. But the turrets acted as if he was not even there. Whats the point of using the deployables if they can be simply ignored?

The bug im wondering if it is a bug is that the turrets take far too long to respond to threats.

jake:weeeeeeee
25th Jul 2005, 02:48 PM
just plaster the node with rocket turrets. as they aren't easy to destroy, the attacking bugger will have to dig through them to reach the node. even the tech will have a hard time with those grenade launcher reload times ^^.

Killinya
25th Jul 2005, 03:35 PM
just plaster the node with rocket turrets. as they aren't easy to destroy, the attacking bugger will have to dig through them to reach the node. even the tech will have a hard time with those grenade launcher reload times ^^.

not that it will matter as your team will lose with no energy. Plastering a node, like Alcazar with Turrets will just drain the energy, and a good ranger will go right thru...

and btw...this is a BUGS forum...not strats....

jake:weeeeeeee
25th Jul 2005, 04:17 PM
and btw...this is a BUGS forum...not strats....it's a strat based on bugs. :D

Emmet Otter
25th Jul 2005, 08:00 PM
While we are on the subject of techs and deploy turrets. I've noticed that when trying to resupply a tech for turrets, you sometimes have to walk over the resupply station several times to get a reload. This is annoying.

IMO, the deployables are almost useless just like redkerensky stated. Its fun to see them in action for defense and was even funner having to have to take em' out when rushing an arty room. Now with a ranger you can just dart in a room and out before they even detect you. No fun :(

Since this 2nd beta, ive found myself using less of these deployables which in turn takes away the urgency to maintain energy not only for registering artys but to hold up defense aswell. Now I seem to find myself only needing energy to register artys and that it!

Bleeder
25th Jul 2005, 09:53 PM
the best place for autoturrets is somehwere in a dark edge, which is at max range from the target - this way you cant see them and cant hear them and unless you know where there, you will be killed each time you try to hunt them down.
hehe u still can't hear the autoturrets anyway, unless you want to crank the sounds way up and go deaf from the "normal" sounds. this, i do believe, should be considered a bug.

Naib
26th Jul 2005, 04:48 AM
The bug im wondering if it is a bug is that the turrets take far too long to respond to threats.

The turrets react at the same speed as the u2xmp ones, and they were still used in clan games against even the fastest attacking rangers.

The other point is, if you did make turrets better, then on maps like rampant or garden, you would never get an artifact stolen. They are easy enough to defend as it is.

GotBeer?
26th Jul 2005, 09:50 AM
Last night this Gunner was able to get through the SunsetBeach node and about 3/4 out of the room before the turrets locked on. If Naib is right and the turret reaction time is the same as u2xmp, could it be they have a narrower range of travel so can't pick you up as soon?
The minigun turrets do need to be louder. Most of the time I take damage before I hear them. No problem hearing the rockets coming, though. At least they're more visible now, so no more dieing at the hands of invisible turrets.

Naib
26th Jul 2005, 10:23 AM
Last night this Gunner was able to get through the SunsetBeach node and about 3/4 out of the room before the turrets locked on.

Do you mean the time before the turrets react, or the time before they started hitting him? If they didn't move at all in that time, it does sound like there is a problem with them. I can't say I've seen that myself

GotBeer?
26th Jul 2005, 11:36 AM
That's when I started getting hit. If the turrets moved before then, I didn't hear them, which returns us to the quietness issue. Or, since I can't turn my volume up too much with a baby sleeping in the next room, it could just be me.

Naib
26th Jul 2005, 03:47 PM
Just had a play round with this, looks like the turret reaction time can be anywhere between instant, and 7-8 secs. But once they do see someone, i think they can track faster than the u2xmp turrets did.