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ZedMaestro
3rd Jun 2005, 09:34 AM
Nice big vehicle map number two from me :)

Firstly, the name is a play on words. The map is a set of islands within a coral reef, so thats the "coral" bit. Its not often you'll find a symmetrical set of islands, but for balancing reasons these are. Therefore there is a correlation between the islands; they're similar in shape, size, and structure. So, mixing up a few letters gives Coralation :B

Thats the cheesy part over. The map is directly based around the content used for ONS-IslandHop, and so it looks quite similar. I didn't want to do a conversion, so I just made my own with a few variations, most noticeably the sky; there is a sky-blue distance fog rather than orange. There is the same vehicle count per team as Rime Valley (Base: 1xManta 1xScorpion 1xHellbender 1xGoliath 2xRaptors, Jail: 1xManta 1xScorpion 1xHellbender 1xRaptor), so its another 10on10 map.

One of the best things about this map I think is the execution. Three ONS Bombers get called in, which drop 15 bombs across the jail. Its also possible to survive... its almost about time for an execution which you can avoid and then prance about afterwards ;).

I have almost too much free time now that exams are over. So I've been powering through this, and the map is only four days old :B
One big visual the map is missing is waves, like ONS-IslandHop has. However, my islands arent the same size as ONS-IslandHop's, so I can't cunningly use the wave static meshes that they have. So... Rev, would you mind if I sent you the map for you to do some smeshing? :D

There's no beta yet because of that. Also, the bot-pathing needs a little more work as they frequently do silly things. Here's some screenshots to keep you happy though :)


Bombers fly over jail.
A lot of bombs.
Switch camera for a closeup of a lot of bombs... and then a messy jail.
The red base. The switch is on the raised ground at the back of the picture, just behind the front rocks of that area.
A random island.

G.Lecter
3rd Jun 2005, 12:35 PM
Wow :eek:, your mapping speed shocks me... :con:
It's looking awesome, keep working....
Just had an idea: now there are too many rocks around the jails and it does not look too realistic... :rolleyes:
1. I think you should move the jail-islands farther from the map, and place the stones in the water (high enough to make players can't jump them swimming).
2. Then, when a player reaches the switch, some mantas (and a raptor?) appear in the jail and allow prisoners to escape... :D

The_Head
3rd Jun 2005, 04:39 PM
the vehicles to get out of jail wouldn't cut it in my opinion. just doesn't seem right. :/
Looks really nice though mate. Look forward to playing it.

btw How did the exams go, I've still got all mine, 9 exams in 4 days :s
after that I'l go on a mapping spree!

ZedMaestro
3rd Jun 2005, 05:39 PM
I've got an idea about the jail; I could raise the terrain within the rocks up. While you would be able to jump off, I could put a nasty xFallingVolume around there. What do you think about that?

I only had 5 exams, spread over 2 weeks. I will have the results by the end of next week. I think I've done fairly well :)

RevBillyG
3rd Jun 2005, 06:25 PM
Send it over m8, I'll have a looksee.

tarquin
4th Jun 2005, 02:24 AM
Looks good! :)

Silas Mercury
4th Jun 2005, 06:56 AM
I agree with Tarquin. This reminds me that I seriously need to learn how to do terrain and water.

ZedMaestro
7th Jun 2005, 05:37 PM
Update time.

Rev is currently waving :wavey:
Sparkles have been put on the water surface, recreating the glint of sunlight off the water.
The occaional bubble appears underwater too.
I did set up a fish emitter, but it was crap so it got scrapped.
I've messed around with some terrain layers and added a plain underwater-sand texture ("plain" as opposed to the one which has rocky bits in it).
I've repathed the map... twice, and bots finally play *quite* well. I just played a game which took 13.5 minutes for me to get the first (and only) capture.
The jail island terrain is now at the same height as the rocks (and the rock smeshes have been changed). Release is by a couple of jump pads as before. Although you can jump off all you like, I put a custom-death volume around the island, along the lines of "ZedMaestro fell off his jail island." There's also an outer volume for free players who get too close to the island, which goes like "ZedMaestro got too close to a jail island." Custom death strings are so much fun :)
The bomber payload has been increased to compensate for the increased floor-space of the jail.
KR-Serenity has been set as the background music (same as SavoIsland's).

Once Rev has finished waving :wavey: I'll release a beta :D

Trueblood
8th Jun 2005, 03:12 AM
I like the stuff underwater...so much better then just sand down there :)
I think you should check out the music from the old jb-freya (nali sky temple music i think) I like the old music conversions

Artman40
8th Jun 2005, 04:59 AM
Underwater...hmmmm...maybe an alternative route to escape from jail (but with most of health lost when you finally get out)? Maybe a snall crack in a cliff, where you must make a 'human' ladder to get there and a crack would lead to the long underwater tunnel, which opens near the beach.

CoolDude
8th Jun 2005, 05:55 AM
I just played a game which took 13.5 minutes for me to get the first (and only) capture.Apart from the botpathing being OK, that also could mean the bases are too open and too hard to defend. Be carefull of that. A lot of games then might end up in a 0-0 going into overtime (I always hate those games).

RevBillyG
8th Jun 2005, 08:09 AM
Apart from the botpathing being OK, that also could mean the bases are too open and too hard to defend. Be carefull of that. A lot of games then might end up in a 0-0 going into overtime (I always hate those games).


Nah, it's coz Zed sucks ;)

ZedMaestro
8th Jun 2005, 10:49 AM
Nah, its coz Zed sucks :):stick:
Well when I play with bots alone I always keep them in the aggressive stance... then they're more likely to stay in their vehicles because they have an objective; to release my teammates. Thus they don't defend much.

Also, it can also be because bots aren't actually that brilliant at defending anyway. You've seen it yourself; bots will just stand about until the enemy actually engages them, and they usually take a decisive blow before they start retaliating.

So there :)

Spudsy
9th Jun 2005, 03:04 PM
Yeah Zed, you're right for Average difficulty. I'm only kidding. The map looks like a keeper and one to bookmark a favorite. Keep crackin at it guys!

Kantham
9th Jun 2005, 03:49 PM
Nice mapping spree :o

I don't hate the Execution idea...

ZedMaestro
10th Jun 2005, 05:35 PM
OK, its about time I released a public beta of this map. RevBillyG has made some fantastic waves to fit around the islands; CoolDude has made a TriggerableUTJumppad for the release off the jail island; and Mychaeel has set up temporary storage for you all to download from. :)

There's still a few things to sort out, but tell me what you think of it so far :)

JB-Coralation-Beta1 (http://mychaeel.no-ip.com/download/zedmaestro/JB-Coralation-Beta1.rar)

Birelli
10th Jun 2005, 10:05 PM
I haven't had a chance to play it yet but as the debate over bases goes...be careful with it. Both me and Spoon quickly realized making Oasis and Alarscia that turrets were going to be needed on vehicle maps to even give the defense a chance. Oasis was too defensive, Alarscia wasn't defensive enough, both maps (were, Oasis has largely been fixed) not much fun online because of this.

RevBillyG
11th Jun 2005, 02:03 AM
I think the layout of this map suits vehicles very well. The bridges between the islands create very good bottlenecks for the vehicles so they're prevented from overrunning the map too much thus giving an unfair advantage.

Aersik
11th Jun 2005, 06:05 AM
Yet another nice map :)

The only probem I found is that some of the trees don't quite reach the ground. Normally I don't notice things like that, but sometimes these things just call out to me :lol: (The screenshot pictured is from the top of the central island, I forgot to show the map on that one). I've attached the worst offenders (although I dare say there's more), but due to size restrictions they're in 4 seperate zips :hmm:

expisCoR
11th Jun 2005, 07:23 AM
As Aersik said, nice map.

The screenshots are my 2 cents:

Kantham
11th Jun 2005, 07:34 AM
You actualy played JB with 24 players? :con:

let me see how spamy it will turn..

G.Lecter
11th Jun 2005, 07:52 AM
Wow, great map Zed, I like these bridges more than IslandHop ones.
Played it more than 30mins. Here some ideas:
- Yes, the matches often go to overtime, but I can’t find any idea to fix this…
- Why don’t you make a different jumpad design? Everyone is is bored of these tech pads... :rolleyes:
- The minigun turrets are locked for the red team… :con:
- The TriggeredJumpad icons are shown ingame...
- When players take the jumpads to escape, do they get some damage when landing if the release protection addon is off??? (I forgot trying this... :p)
- More cameras in the execution? ;)
- Again, after releasing my team, I have no more choice than camping around the enemy switch if I lose my vehicle. Spawning a manta near the switch (when a player releases his team) to allow the releaser to escape from the enemy base could be a possible solution... :rolleyes: (SuperApe made actors to spawn vehicles with triggers, ask him if you want to use them... ;) http://forums.unrealplayground.com/showthread.php?t=23515)
- Picture: Scorpions get stuck here...

Spudsy
11th Jun 2005, 10:34 AM
I haven't spent much time on this map yet, but I did manage to get a few minutes in. I like it, it's huge and I feel like it's the father of Savo Island, which also was a very good map. The execution sequence is great and when you put Gilbalicious II on, it makes it all the better. Anywho, it is a nice map, and it was well thought out, I'll look to keep playing for testing purposes, but this map kicks............. um teeth? Trying to be clean for the boards. I'm only kidding, this map rocks!

The_Head
11th Jun 2005, 02:02 PM
Looks really beautifull :D
Like Spudsey said its a bit like Savo-Island, reminds me of when I first played that map back about a year ago - a great feeling to bring back.

And as G. Lector said, try something new with the jumpads, something with a more organic feel to it? perhaps little water fountains?

Trueblood
11th Jun 2005, 02:21 PM
something with a more organic feel to it? perhaps little water fountains?
lol, its meant to be a prison and possibly the place of your death...you want to look at water fountains before you go? :lol:
--
The map is bigger then I thought o_o;
needs more then 15 bots i think, i only saw 1 on the other team in like 10mins (appart from the last tart who kept flying away in raptor :mad: )
Due to annoying bots i didnt play for too long :p but it looks cool, love the waves :)
speaking of waves :rolleyes: :) abit of mark sir.
http://img7.echo.cx/img7/1267/wavy6jk.jpg

ZedMaestro
11th Jun 2005, 02:28 PM
:)

I'm not surprised that there are floating trees about. When I first placed them they were all ok, but then I went around smoothing the terrain to make Rev's wave-making easier, so the terrain was adjusted, especially near the shores. I'll fly around and check them out.

Yeah, I'll have a look at a new jump pad design. Water fountains are a nice idea actually :)

Heh, oops. I always play as blue so I do sometimes miss red-base problems. I'll fix those turrets and check around for any other problems. ;)

The TriggerableUTJumppad icons were only made visible for testing purposes, and I've obviously forgotten to make them hidden again :p

If you have release protection you don't get hurt when you land on the "main" island. You can even go through the nasty volumes surrounding the jail without being hurt. Since those who do shield fights sometimes don't get release protection I'll make a landing pad which prevents damage to you.

I will put some more execution cameras inn :)

Spawning a vehicle upon triggering is an interesting idea actually. I'd also ensure that you couldn't spawn multiple Mantas too, for example. What does everyone else think of this idea?

It will be extremely difficult to ensure that Scorpions and other vehicles can't ever get stuck, but if its a major problem in a major area I will investigate. I'll see what I can do for this particular example.

Edit:
Yes, I'll lower that wave too ;)

expisCoR
11th Jun 2005, 04:10 PM
Hmm, spawn a random vehicle.

Spudsy
11th Jun 2005, 06:06 PM
Yeah The Head is right here. This map brings back golden memories of Savo Island. Anywho, the map is certainly not Savo and it is certainly not a map you can hate. This is one sweet ride, and I mean that pun.

TheSpoonDog
11th Jun 2005, 08:36 PM
Hey Zed - to save you some time - make a raw key binding in advanced options to "ACTOR ALIGN SNAPTOFLOOR ALIGN=0". Then select all of the trees, move them up so all of them would be above the ground, and hit that key. What it does is put all the pivots on the ground. So even if the pivot of those trees is too high or too low, at least they'll be all at the same height and you can adjust them all in about 5 seconds :) That's one of the commands I use all the time, every day at work - mostly for pathnodes but also handy for these kind of things too.

ZedMaestro
12th Jun 2005, 06:55 AM
Ooo, how cheeky :p

Well I've actually already checked all the trees, so I don't need to do that. However, that's very useful information should I need to do similar levelling again :)

ZedMaestro
14th Jun 2005, 11:22 AM
Time for the second batch of screenshots. Almost all suggested features have been added, with the notable exception of a vehicle which could spawn when you hit the release switch.

The release switch is quite exposed, and a camping player has little to hide behind. Without a vehicle they're quite weak, and health isn't exactly near either. While you may be able to hide away from bots, against humans campers who don't have a vehicle will have little chance of camping the switch for long. This is in contrast to RimeValley where the camper has plenty of health, has a nearby ammo source, and is indoors, which is why the TeamTeleporter (which still needs to be debugged for bots by the way) was placed there. Consequently, I don't think that a vehicle or teleporter is necessary here.

I've also got round to making an arena, which has similarites to SavoIsland's, but it is smaller and only has a Link Gun and Minigun. While I thought about a Manta-battle-arena, that would require another vehicle map waiting for JB2004c before bots knew what to do.

And I think that a new beta is due. Have fun :)

JB-Coralation-Beta2 (http://mychaeel.no-ip.com/download/zedmaestro/JB-Coralation-Beta2.rar)

Spudsy
14th Jun 2005, 01:26 PM
Thanks Zed! You're doing great dude, keep up the very high quality work you got going on here dude, this map is definately a keeper!

The_Head
14th Jun 2005, 02:53 PM
woooo water fountain jumppads :p I'm a genius..... (maybe not)

Looking sweeter and sweeter by the minute

G.Lecter
14th Jun 2005, 03:18 PM
A few more ideas:
> The map is really fun when I am driving a vehicle, but I think going on foot is a pain...
- What about placing a neutral scorpion (or manta) in each island (or some of them) between the bases and the jail vehicles, and 2 more neutral vehicles in the central island?
- Or jumpads to make pedestrians go faster? (I don't like this too much but...) :rolleyes:
- If not, leave it as it is now and players will have to learn dodgejumpwalking :D
> I think the jumpad bases should be a bit smaller. The emmiters look cool.
> The emmiters of the jail-jumpads are too long and players don't follow the same trayectory as the particles. I don't like the new landing platforms, I rarely fall on them... :con:
> Could you make the jail-jumpads a little faster?
> Shock and BioRifle would work better in the arena IMO...
> Pictures 1 & 2: You sometimes have to do a jump to go onto these platforms. Rise the terrain a bit around them or and blocking...
> Picture 3: Self-explanatory :p
> Picture 4: These stones look nearly black...

ZedMaestro
14th Jun 2005, 04:42 PM
I'm always a bit wary of neutral vehicles. The jails vehicles were positioned so that you (most of the time) weren't far away from something important, be it a game objective or accessible vehicle. In the neutral islands I always ensure that there is something of value, which is typically a Super Shield or Keg, a Super Weapon (not that the Target Painter is really that super), and/or a powerful weapon like a Rocket Launcher or Avril.
Walking is always going to be a down-side of a vehicle map, but it has to be done sometime, which is why I think everyone should just get the hang of dodge-double-jumping instead of walking. Even the bots sometimes do that ;)
I think the size of the Jump Pad platforms is ok because it means there's a noticeable amount of water there. Also, the emitter spawns some splashes which move across the surface.
Jump Pads are odd. For some reason they don't launch you all of the way to the destination Navigation Point. The only way I can get this to work is by adding a bit of height to the jump, which then makes the jump feel longer and slower. The Red Jail Jump Pads in particular had this problem, :con: and I could have sworn that I made them so that you landed on that pad. You aren't holding down a movement button are you? And you did walk into the Jump Pad rather than jump on to it?
Would other people rather switch the arena weapons to Shock Rifle and Bio Rifle?
Is it really that much to ask you to jump up onto those platforms? :p Its also quite awkward to get the terrain to fit the platform so that it doesnt show through it.
Fixed that gap. :)
The only lighting in the map is done by a few SunLight actors, and thats what they think the lighting should be. There is meant to be a shadow actually, as the SunLight actors all face north. But since the sun in the SkyBox is shining down, I suppose I'll have to make the SunLight actors shine downwards. :rolleyes:

The_Head
14th Jun 2005, 04:48 PM
For the Sunlights:

Have the main Sunlight that creates all the nice shadows, then have 2 more sunlights with lower brightnesses, about 10 to stop those harsh shadows.
Learnt that one from Hourences ;)
Will post some feedback on the map tomorrow as I have been out all day today.

4WD
14th Jun 2005, 05:35 PM
LOL stay in jail on that rock in the middle, select shieldgun ... aaand watch the bots commiting suicide ROLFOLFOOLOOO!!!1!1!111 :D

ZedMaestro
14th Jun 2005, 05:59 PM
Hmm, I'll give that SunLight trick a go.

And yes, I know about the stupidity of the bots in jail when shield-gun-fighting. I assume they think they can run to freedom. Idiots :rolleyes:

expisCoR
14th Jun 2005, 08:18 PM
I would not like to see shock/bio in the arena.

ZedMaestro
15th Jun 2005, 07:36 AM
Oooh dear. I just checked out the Red Jail Jump Pads and, well, ok, they're not quite right. More fixing to do :(

Alhanalem
15th Jun 2005, 08:54 AM
Can you make the foliage smaller? I feel kinda small in this map, but the blades of grass and such on the terrain are gigantic.

Trueblood
16th Jun 2005, 05:06 AM
I'm always a bit wary of neutral vehicles.
yeah, the tank at the red base was available to me as blue...i caused chaos on the defence :-)

The jump pads are funny to watch from a distance...i dont know what the bots do, but some dont get near main land.
http://img86.echo.cx/img86/515/lolz8km.th.jpg (http://img86.echo.cx/my.php?image=lolz8km.jpg)
Some make to safe water and swim for it (easy pickins :-) ) but some explode :eek:

The walking (or side step jumpy thing :rolleyes: ) is a long way :hmm: how about a rough looking raft (movers as you mappers call em :p ) that alternates over the water.
http://img147.echo.cx/img147/2505/raft2kv.th.jpg (http://img147.echo.cx/my.php?image=raft2kv.jpg)
good for the unlucky ones who missed the ride, which will enable them to get to main island where the good stuff is. :)

ZedMaestro
16th Jun 2005, 06:09 AM
OK, I'll reduce the size of the plants.

I've fixed those jump pads for Beta3.

If I were to place rafts, they would have to be pathed as a lift. Obviously it'd take a little while for the rafts to cross over and back, and bots will quite happily stand still and wait for the lift to come to them... thus an easy target.

For neutral vehicles, the furthest I'll go would be to put a neutral scorpion next to the Avril and the Target Painter. All the neutral islands conveniently have a bridge to the middle. These vehicles would be set to Team 2 (Red=0 and Blue=1), so everytime you got into a "freshly spawned" neutral unlocked scorpion it would be a "hijack". So if you find yourself without a vehicle, run over to the middle, grab one of the powerful weapons, and get a free car.

Sounds like a TV game show :hmm:

Hans Oberlander
17th Jun 2005, 02:03 AM
Cuban Cigaro Speedboat anyone?

G.Lecter
17th Jun 2005, 03:53 PM
2 more minor bugs: :rolleyes:
- There's a floating tree near one of the Raptors in the Red Base.
- Picture: Red Jail-island:

ZedMaestro
20th Jun 2005, 10:43 AM
So would the single neutral Scorpion at each of the weapons on the centre island suffice?

expisCoR
20th Jun 2005, 12:07 PM
Sounds fine to me.

ZedMaestro
21st Jun 2005, 06:18 PM
OK, I've fixed those two teeny bugs and placed the "neutral" Scorpions. Since they're technically an "enemy" vehicle to players when they're freshly spawned you can also damage them (whereas you cannot damage "friendly" vehicles).

Thankfully, bots seem to get the idea too, so thats that.

Is there anything else that you want to suggest? Anything else need fixing? Are the fps ok on your PCs? If nothing comes up I'll consider the Beta3 I have as Final and upload it to NaliCity for release. \o/

Spudsy
21st Jun 2005, 07:43 PM
The fps rate is fine on my comp, the stage looks beautiful and I found no real problems with it. The bots use vehicles most of the time, and they know what to do.

G.Lecter
22nd Jun 2005, 12:16 PM
I have no more ideas... 2 scorpions in the centre island are enough, and the framerates are OK in my computer too... so I think you could release it when you want... :)

Vatcilli zeitchef
24th Jun 2005, 07:27 AM
Can't find beta 3 also tried 'find on page'
but even that won't work.
I downloaded beta 2 but probably
if I find any bugs they are already solved;)

ZedMaestro
24th Jun 2005, 07:37 AM
Lol I havent released Beta3... and even so it'll probably be the final version I upload to NaliCity.

Its a good thing I didn't upload it a few days ago as I've found numerous places where you can swim under the rocks, all of which have been fixed. Havent found any more floating trees though :)

ZedMaestro
24th Jun 2005, 03:07 PM
OK, I started the upload process to NaliCity, but the connection broke. Since you cant overwrite files on the ftp I've gotta wait until its removed. Then I'll upload it again :)

Last chance to suggest anything or to inform me about something I've missed :p

Sexmachine
24th Jun 2005, 03:40 PM
Why don't you put it on QFile (http://www.qfile.de/operator.php?sysm=file_transfer&sysf=index&new_lang=2) first (as a beta) so we can test and give you feedback ?

ZedMaestro
24th Jun 2005, 03:57 PM
Ok :)

JB-Coralation-Beta3 (http://www.qfile.de/dl/48263/jb-coralation-beta3.zip.html)

Sexmachine
26th Jun 2005, 04:56 AM
Got it! Thanks. :)

ZedMaestro
26th Jun 2005, 06:06 AM
Any chance that Coralation-Beta3 could be put onto the Mothership for multiplay testing? Could you also put RimeValley-Beta2 up there? It wouldn't interfere with the Tournament as, firstly there are no matches tonight, and secondly teams wouldn't be allowed to vote for them anyway :)

Hmm, and also lets hope that everyone gets the maps before tonight's lockdown so that people don't have to download them during play ;)

tarquin
26th Jun 2005, 08:17 AM
Any chance that Coralation-Beta3 could be put onto the Mothership for multiplay testing?

That's a good idea.
Let me know how it goes -- it could be a good idea to beta test maps on the mothership regularly.

ZedMaestro
26th Jun 2005, 08:22 AM
And if it happens you could always keep the news flowing and inform people to download the maps beforehand :)

Sexmachine
28th Jun 2005, 02:50 AM
That's a good idea.
Let me know how it goes -- it could be a good idea to beta test maps on the mothership regularly.I did as requested this time (http://forums.beyondunreal.com/showpost.php?p=1842842&postcount=2) but in the long run I don't think this is a viable way. Uploading megs and megs of maps to the server whenever a new beta comes along (keep in mind that these maps are often +20MB) is not worth the hassle. It's way more comfortable to agree on a time for testing and host these maps on a listen server for that given time.

Spudsy
28th Jun 2005, 02:34 PM
Sex is right here, maybe when a new beta is released, the mapper or someone knowing of the mapper can declare a time and server with each beta release. If all goes well, the beta testing can go a lot quicker and smotther.

Spudsy
1st Jul 2005, 10:42 PM
Zed, I have found a minor, yet significant bug in Colilation Beta 3. When swimming far far out into the ocean, to the point where the ocean floor drops deeper, the Ion Cannon targets you for annihlation, forcing you to stay in the stage. There is a problem with this however. The Ion Cannon, which targets and delivers a countdown warning to the deserting palyer, fails to fire. The Ion Cannon ceases to track you all together if you are full submerged under water. When above water the Ion Cannon targets you, but a player will sink slowly under water when not holding the jump button to emerge. Follow me so far? A player not moving will quickly go slightly underwater, yet full submerged none the less. When a player holds the space bar or jump button, he bobs up and down, yet stays above the surface the entire time. This is where the probblem really kicks in. With every bob, the countdown resets to 9 and the Ion Cannon will constantly be rest at 9 for every bob, which happens every second. So, the problem is that the Ion Cannon, does not target you under water, and fails to fire if you are not. If asking why this is of importance, someone online could use this to swim out far, undetected, and pop up in the enemy base. Please make sure the targeting area covers above and below the water surface, and try to see what you can do to fixing the bobbing problem.

ZedMaestro
6th Jul 2005, 07:16 AM
Yeah the IonCannonKill volume doesnt work if you move in and out of a water volume.

Thats an easy fix though; I just set the IonCannonKill volume to work above the surface, and set a pain volume in the water beneath it around the outer edge of the map.

The_Head
7th Jul 2005, 04:29 PM
See the screeny. Nice simple fix. I didnt get stuck but the tank hit a bump slowed down to about half full speed and lost some height. could be quite annoying in the think of the action. Not sure how the bump effects other vehicles. though.

Birelli
7th Jul 2005, 04:46 PM
Perhaps a vehicle blocker is in order around the switches for this one. As I demonstrated in the test today parking the Goliath tank on top of your switch is an extremely effective defense. It could just apply to the tank but I suppose the Hellbender would also do fine in a pinch, or a combination of smaller vehicles would also prove a problem. I personally don't think the Goliath should really be in the map at all, but I'm probably outnumbered on that one. Also the bases could probably use a shock turret for defense against a Raptor release-drop (just jump out over the switch), but maybe that's already balanced well enough, I'm not sure.

The_Head
7th Jul 2005, 04:48 PM
I think small underground section for the switch or perhaps have it on top of a rock. This would stop the blocking of the switch with vehicles, or atleast make it much more difficult

ZedMaestro
7th Jul 2005, 05:20 PM
I'll just shove a reasonably-sized set of rocks around the switch and put a vehicle-specific blocker around it. While if you tried to fly a manta over the switch you might hit the collision, thats an insignificant side effect. I'd rather not put a rock-roof over it.

I'll just lower those raised planks of wood where that tank is and modify the terrain to fit the bridge.

Would replacing the minigun turrets with the ONS "shock" turrets be better? They do work with JB, so its not exactly a difficult change.

G.Lecter
8th Jul 2005, 06:28 PM
Would replacing the minigun turrets with the ONS "shock" turrets be better? They do work with JB, so its not exactly a difficult change.I think they would be too powerful and that would encourage camping too much... :(

Spudsy
8th Jul 2005, 11:13 PM
Also, Zed, there's a problem with the map boundaries. As I came to the floor of the ocean on Thursday online, I seemed to be able to go way far past it. Check the corner boundaries and make sure it corresponds both with the corner of the ocean floor and with the actually wall boundary all together. Lol, leave it to me to find this bug :p.

The_Head
9th Jul 2005, 04:39 AM
Was just an excuse to make us wait for ages trying to find you.

ZedMaestro
9th Jul 2005, 05:54 AM
The ocean floor in no way represents where the IonCannonKillVolume boundary begins. That bit of the ocean floor is a second TerrainInfo with a small X/Y size and huge scale (thus low polys for big size terrain). I made the Ion volume a bit further out so that there was more space for Raptors to fly around in. However, since that seems unnecessary I'll bring in the boundaries.

What should happen about these turrets then?

Birelli
9th Jul 2005, 10:47 AM
What should happen about these turrets then?
IMO the bases are pretty weakly defended right now, certainly in a Manta or a Raptor I never once felt like there was a possibility I couldn't release my team solo. Maybe if both turrets were manned and the goliath was camping the over-land routes from the back and there were guys with shock/lightning on the ground it'd be tough, but I think a shock turret would help. Maybe just one shock turret in addition to the minigun ones?

It'd be nice to test out the balance with more players, but at the same time we had close to a 5v5 going on Thursday, which is the player load the map is most likely to see. It's no use balancing the map for huge player loads if it never sees them. Maybe with 8v8 the extra base defense would start to make it very defense-heavy, but I just think with 5v5 and only 2 maybe 3 defenders there's not much they can do to stop an attack.

ZedMaestro
9th Jul 2005, 11:36 AM
How about an ONS Turret coming away from the Weapon Locker down by the Hellbender/Goliath area, sticking out from that circle in the direction of the sea?

In that way the turret would be in a good position to take on Raptors but not that useful for vehicles and players that were a fair distance away from the switch (like on the bridges).

Jailbreak gets played at the FragBU, not that I've ever been part of it myself. I've heard that lots of players play during that time, but most Jailbreak maps are too small for 8on8 or more. So maybe at the FragBU these larger maps would be played more often.

Birelli
9th Jul 2005, 11:54 AM
Yeah I like that idea, makes it harder to do a Raptor drop but doesn't make it impossible for scorpions and mantas to get close. And If there's someone in the Goliath good luck getting a ground vehicle to the switch anyway, heh.

ZedMaestro
9th Jul 2005, 12:32 PM
And If there's someone in the Goliath good luck getting a ground vehicle to the switch anyway, heh.Thats the interesting decision a team has to make; whether to have an extremely strong offense and take the tank to the enemy base, or to leave it at their base for an extremely strong defense :)

Birelli
9th Jul 2005, 03:54 PM
Not really a choice IMO, any team with Raptor pilots worth the bandwith they take up makes taking the goliath into the field a poor choice, but that's all part of the game :)

Spudsy
9th Jul 2005, 07:43 PM
Look, the vehicle layout is fine, it's all about the players choices and the vehicle matchups. I say, don't touch the vehicles.

ZedMaestro
14th Jul 2005, 09:35 AM
OK

I've brought in the boundaries of the IonCannon volume and the painful WaterVolume boundary. It does not correspond to the appearance of the sea floor.
I've put an ONSTurrent behind the lower spawn circle. There are considerably fewer controls available to perfect their abilities, so they're permanently locked to their team throughout the game. Also, something beyond my control, the wreckage of a destroyed ONSTurret has no collision. Nevermind.
The TargetPainter "superweapon" in the middle has been replaced with an Avril, thus making a total of two Avril pickups, both on the middle island. The Target Painter was useless, and now there's a higher chance of a bot picking up an Avril.
Bots still arent as clever as one would like them to be, but I cant do much more about that. One would hope that you wouldnt be playing this map with bots anyway...

Unless you desperately want to test this out before I release it, speak up. Otherwise I'll upload my Beta4 to NaliCity this weekend. I've had enough of waiting for feedback and online testing without enough players.

The_Head
14th Jul 2005, 11:17 AM
Lack of collision on the gun:
Couldn't you just put a blocking volume around it?

ZedMaestro
14th Jul 2005, 01:20 PM
Its only got no collision around the wreckage of the turret; when its functional or idle it does have collision. The wreckage is only present for about 15 seconds before a new turret respawns.

I dont know if a blocking volume on a Vehicle pawn would go down too well with the game. Personally it really doesnt bother me either; its not as if there's any advantage of the lack of collision on the wreckage either.

G.Lecter
14th Jul 2005, 05:19 PM
I'll upload my Beta4 to NaliCity this weekend.Are you calling it 'Beta4'? That won't make a very attractive download. You should call it JB-Coralation and then if something needs to be changed (I think that won't happen ;)), call the new one JB-Coralation-v2... :rolleyes:

ZedMaestro
14th Jul 2005, 05:28 PM
You should call it JB-CoralationYes of course; I didn't make that clear enough back there. NaliCity wouldn't allow anything with a title like that because they only host full versions anyway :)

ZedMaestro
15th Jul 2005, 05:17 PM
Well I couldnt find any problems, so I'm about to upload JB-Coralation-Beta4 as JB-Coralation to NaliCity.

The ONS Turret seems to work quite well; it is powerful, but it has very little armour. A single tank shell will blast them to pieces, and it doesnt take too many Raptor plasma projectiles to take them out either. So in that way they are also vulnerable.

I'll get a link from NaliCity as soon as its available.

ZedMaestro
20th Jul 2005, 03:22 AM
Released (http://nalicity.beyondunreal.com/map_hub.php?mid=8590)

Vatcilli zeitchef
20th Jul 2005, 05:34 AM
I'm sorry for going here but aren't we posting any forum shortcuts on the news page anymore?
I can't find the forums in annother way and I like to stay informed.
Thank you!

CoolDude
20th Jul 2005, 06:30 AM
I can't find the forums in annother way and I like to stay informed.Ehhh ...

1) Add http://forums.beyondunreal.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=379 to your favorites ??? ;).

2) Choose Jailbreak Forums on the Homepage (http://www.planetjailbreak.com/) (see pic).

But Tarquin probably will do a news article on releasing Coralation (http://nalicity.beyondunreal.com/map_hub.php?mid=8590).

Thanks Zed. :)

tarquin
20th Jul 2005, 07:25 AM
News is duly posted. But I usually only put a link to the thread for a map if it's a beta.

ZedMaestro
20th Jul 2005, 08:13 AM
Thanks tarquin :tup:
Just to be picky...
and you travel between them with jump pads or flying vehicles....and via the wooden bridges :)

Spudsy
20th Jul 2005, 11:02 AM
Nice job Zed on another great map dude.

G.Lecter
20th Jul 2005, 11:45 AM
Great map Zed, your best one at the moment... :)

ZedMaestro
20th Jul 2005, 03:08 PM
To everyone apart from G.Lecter who already has, don't forget to go and post comments on JB-Coralation's NaliCity page :)

SuperApe
27th Jul 2005, 07:20 PM
This is a late response but my ears were burning. (ow!)

Spawning a random vehicle via trigger might not be too
hard to do. It's just a tweak to the custom actor that's
there already. You'd want a short list of possible vehicles
to spawn that you can set up in the editor, then you'd go
off a random number and spawn one of those vehicle types.
It shouldn't be hard.

Please ask me on the UnrealPlayground forums here if you
want to go ahead with something like that in the future:
http://forums.unrealplayground.com/showthread.php?t=23515

SuperApe
28th Jul 2005, 01:51 PM
I went ahead and added that feature you suggested on this thread.
Here (http://forums.unrealplayground.com/showthread.php?t=23515) is the updated TeamVehicleFactory, now with the ability to spawn random vehicle classes from a predefined list. It's also on the wiki (http://wiki.beyondunreal.com/wiki/TeamVehicleFactory) in case you or anyone else would like to do that in the future. :D

Sexmachine
30th Jul 2005, 02:41 PM
It took me quite a while (sorry Zed) but the map has finally found it's way to the Jailbreak 2004 MotherShip (http://www.planetjailbreak.com/community/lockdown.html). :D

Vatcilli zeitchef
7th Aug 2005, 07:16 AM
Id really wish I could join fraggin there but strangely I get logged out every five minutes I'm online I bet some sicko uses my cd key.