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1337
23rd May 2005, 10:14 PM
One thing I dislike is when projectiles I manage to hit someone directly in the face with don't do damage. Yet splash damage from spamming someone's feet with them always gives damage.

Xaero_UT
23rd May 2005, 11:12 PM
to understand what u say, is this with netcode enabled, or just in general

netcode: its to be expected, there are certain situations where hitting them with lg does nothing, while in others, i might miss them by a metre, but it still records the hit, mind u this is with my 180 ping. because it simply records the shot as how it shouldve hit, not where it does.

normal: hasnt ever happened to me, but if it does, then yeah, could be fixed.

1337
23rd May 2005, 11:26 PM
It happens to me all the time with regular. But you probably haven't noticed it because you don't spam rockets as much as I do.

I can't say I like the "enhanced netcode" UTComp feature, because I have a low end computer and I get lots of packetloss, so the enhanced netcode only makes it harder for me to move around and play competently.

I have observed that people with higher end setups and steady ping are the ones that benefit from this enhanced netcode, but people like me with a bad setup and packetloss don't benefit from it and it can also make it unplayable. Even while playing offline, I can notice the enhanced netcode borking my movement.

JohnDoe641
24th May 2005, 01:10 AM
It's a networking problem that is inherent in the Unreal engine. Every single Unreal engine game to date has the projectile bug.

Unless they completely scrapped the netcode, I doubt that it is gone. :c

edhe
24th May 2005, 03:40 AM
It's inherent to the 'net someone else was saying, it's the nature of packets.

They've been trying for 7 years to eliminate it, good luck to them finding the solution.

JaFO
24th May 2005, 05:44 AM
It happens to me all the time with regular. ...
I have a low end computer and I get lots of packetloss,
...
There's your problem.
Epic (and anyone else except *insert favourite deity or supernatural being*) can't magically create packets with vital information that were lost en-route to the server.
Therefor any game played over the internet is going to suffer from 'dud' missiles (and related events).

The only thing that Epic & co could do would be to sent multiple redundant packages with the same info, but then they'd double the bandwidth required at little to no gain. Never mind the fact that with the higher bandwidth-requirement slow/bad connections would suffer even more ...

T2A`
24th May 2005, 12:26 PM
I get dud projectiles and I don't get packetloss. Worst thing ever.

Xipher
24th May 2005, 02:20 PM
To really tell you the truth, its the fact that they use UDP, therfor its connectionless, and unreliable. TCP has to much over head though for games, at least it had too much, but it might change, just have to wait and see. I personally don't know too many FPS that don't use UDP for network play, but since its unreliable, stuff like dud projectials happens. TCP makes sure as part of the protocol that every piece of data sent always makes it, but if one packet is delayed, it delays every thing, since it waits till it has all the data, in order, before it continues. Most use UDP, since the client can simply resend it if needed, since some data can get lost in small amounts, and not effect any thing, like locations in the map, if a player moves, but that packet is lost, in the next one his location is updated again, so the old one is outdated, and not needed. this is also where the rubber band effect comes in, since the client lets you move, but if it doesn't get a response from the server that says you really did move every so offten, it takes you back to the last position it did get the server response from.

so is that as clear as thick mud or what?

1337
24th May 2005, 04:17 PM
There's your problem.
Epic (and anyone else except *insert favourite deity or supernatural being*) can't magically create packets with vital information that were lost en-route to the server.
Therefor any game played over the internet is going to suffer from 'dud' missiles (and related events).

The only thing that Epic & co could do would be to sent multiple redundant packages with the same info, but then they'd double the bandwidth required at little to no gain. Never mind the fact that with the higher bandwidth-requirement slow/bad connections would suffer even more ...
The splash damage always registers so why doesn't a direct hit register more consistently? Other people complain about this too that have decent connections. I think I heard someone say it happens in LAN games aswell.

Discord
24th May 2005, 04:31 PM
It's not because of network conditions... it's because projectile hits are determined by prediction rather than tracking. The reason that's done is to lighten the load on the server.

Throw in clientside weapon FX drawing and limitations on tick rate, and small wonder that clients are describing hits where servers are calling misses. Splash damage doesn't miss nearly as often because the larger hit radius is also a larger margin for error. ;)

To hear Mysterial et al describe it, the dud projectiles are really the lesser of two evils since tracking all projectiles everywhere on the map at all times would (or so the claim goes) put enormous strain on the server. Some folks will argue about it, but that's Epic's story and they're sticking to it.

So in that sense, it's not even a "known bug" so much as a "difficult design decision."

kafros
25th May 2005, 02:30 AM
what does dud mean?

BooGiTyBoY
25th May 2005, 03:40 AM
dud (dŭd) pronunciation
n.

1. A bomb, shell, or explosive round that fails to detonate.