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View Full Version : Weaponbases and armor in Envy?


Zygar
30th Mar 2005, 01:33 PM
Yeah, I'm curious, now that Epic is ditching the sports style of the newer UT games, whether the shield belt and area based armor will return. I liked the way the shield belt actually took the damage for you, rather than, like the UT2004 armor, just dampened it down. I liked that little guy in the top right of the screen which showed you where you were taking damage, and how getting thigh pads or whatever would reduce damage taken in that area. Imagine this in the next UT, you see someone running up to you, with full armor, except on thier legs.
So you remove their kneecaps with the flak cannon.

And another thing - weapon and health bases. Any news on whether they're going to be in? I prefer the older style health packs to these new holograms that hover over some thing on the ground. I used to map for the orig ut, and one thing I liked to do occasionally was stick healthpacks on walls, or lean a weapon up against something. UT2k4 made this pretty much impossible. :( I suppose there ARE benefits to having health bases, such as... uhh... not... having to remember where the health is. C'mon, I don't think health and weapon bases really added much depth to the game, I wouldn't mind seeing them go.

-AEnubis-
30th Mar 2005, 02:09 PM
Helps learn the maps better, without doing it offline where there isn't somone who already knows it to cycle it on you. Either way, I know what I have to do to learn it, so it doesn't matter to me. I don't think they look that bad.

I personally, hated everything about the shiled belt, and love the new armor system.

Radiosity
30th Mar 2005, 02:26 PM
C'mon, I don't think health and weapon bases really added much depth to the game, I wouldn't mind seeing them go.


Not aesthetically, no. The pickup bases do however help bot AI quite a bit.

JaFO
30th Mar 2005, 03:57 PM
Those bases were pure code, there's technically no need for any visible static mesh to be attached to those spots excpet for us poor humans. AFAIK it's possible to set the staticmeshes to be invisible or at least drop them below the floor.

Besides ... I sort of keep hoping that they do implement the health/shield-bases like they had in Unreal 2 and Half-life. And I think that armor/shields are going to behave very different if they really are going to implement race/model-specific statistics this time.

One can only hope they do it as the dynamics of the entire game would change.
Imagine choosing a model for 'realistic' reasons (amount of armour/shields/health) instead of psychological reasons (ie : Satin only 'appears' to be difficult to hit).

Actually seeing the armor on the models would be nice, but somehow I doubt that is going to happen (far too many variables involved). It's not like shooting a hat/helmet of someone's head.

An energy-shield like UT/Unreal shouldn't be done as it just wouldn't look right at in the kind of high-detail environments that are part of this next-gen engine.

btw : doesn't anyone find it odd that no UT-competitor ever used a helmet or any other form of headprotection ?

spineblaZe
30th Mar 2005, 04:10 PM
I liked that little guy in the top right of the screen which showed you where you were taking damage, and how getting thigh pads or whatever would reduce damage taken in that area.

You are sorely mistaken, I'm afraid. UT Thighpads protected your head and feet just as much as your thighs. They provided 50 armor, and it was 50 armor everywhere, no matter where you got shot.

It was also a common misconception that shooting people in the head with every weapon killed them faster. With the exception of the Sniper and Ripper, all weapons did the same damage whether you shot them in the head or the foot.

T2A`
30th Mar 2005, 04:32 PM
I like the new armor system where shots are dampened instead of completely absorbed. UT2003 used the latter option, and they changed it, so what does that say?

I don't care about the bases though. They help ease the learning curve, which is already too high as it is. Perhaps for higher difficulty levels and competitive matches they can have the bases invisible... Though, being competitive means making the game easier for yourself with brightskins and hit sounds and what not, so that probably won't happen. :p

1337
30th Mar 2005, 04:34 PM
In ut2k4 if your last shot on someone before they go down is in the head, their head flies off. Pretty cool.

Bang Yr Head
30th Mar 2005, 05:18 PM
btw : doesn't anyone find it odd that no UT-competitor ever used a helmet or any other form of headprotection ?

only when they ride their bikes :D

iron12
30th Mar 2005, 09:33 PM
Originally Posted by JaFO- btw : doesn't anyone find it odd that no UT-competitor ever used a helmet or any other form of headprotection ?

Why you just go get a new head.

hal
30th Mar 2005, 11:07 PM
I've seen plenty of UT2004 maps that don't have pickup bases. I've even seen some that have pickups stuck to the walls. Check out the remake of Scandinavium for one.

-AEnubis-
31st Mar 2005, 12:34 AM
Yeah, it is really up to the map author. It shouldn't be up to the devs, especially if they just give it to you as an option, as they more or less did.

B
31st Mar 2005, 06:51 AM
I like the new armor system where shots are dampened instead of completely absorbed. UT2003 used the latter option, and they changed it, so what does that say?
Nothing, since UT used it too, and it was good.

Mr.Magnetichead
1st Apr 2005, 08:20 AM
Personally I loved the Holo pads for health and ammo, they looked really nice and were really easy to spot whne in fast combat.

Zygar
2nd Apr 2005, 08:45 PM
I know you can hide the health bases, I just hate the hologram health pack, you can't make it look like a health pack mounted on a wall even if you remove the bases. The original health packs were so versatile, you could put them anywhere. With these ones, about the only place you can put them where it looks somewhat normal is on the floor.

I like the new armor system where shots are dampened instead of completely absorbed. UT2003 used the latter option, and they changed it, so what does that say?
UT had the 2k4 style armor system too... as well as the shield belt. What would you rather have - 2k3 style armor, 2k4 style armor, or both, like in the original ut?

Vault
14th Jun 2005, 01:29 PM
maybe they should have a health pad that when you stand on it, it starts to recharge your health, no more health boxes. they could also have ammo pads, and armor pads

The_Head
14th Jun 2005, 02:44 PM
maybe they should have a health pad that when you stand on it, it starts to recharge your health, no more health boxes. they could also have ammo pads, and armor pads
Sorry but I must say that would be ****...

In a slow game like Halo whree you can take a break to get ur life back then carry on through SP mode... yeh that works.

Standing still in the middle of a DM match to regain your life is a ludicrus idea. "hang on let me just charge my health and you can line up the sniper rifle on my head......"

-AEnubis-
14th Jun 2005, 03:09 PM
Would only make sense with team bases involved.

JaFO
14th Jun 2005, 03:13 PM
I know you can hide the health bases, I just hate the hologram health pack, you can't make it look like a health pack mounted on a wall even if you remove the bases. ...
You should look at Angelheart's maps ... he often replaced the health-holograms with something that fit the level.
ie : there was nothing that said you had to use the 'official' static meshes, altough using the official meshes (and bases) made it easier for new players to recognise the healthpacks et al.

// The_Head
Health-generators were part of the original plan for UC/UT2k3.
AFAIK the idea was that the items would recharge slowly (thereby allowing you to choose between picking up part of the health or waiting) instead of the on/off-situation for current health- and ammo-packs.

I think such items would work in the things like ONS & Conquest.
DM probably could be different. Perhaps removing the concept of healtpacks completely and relying on nothing but the shield & armour to protect yourself from damage ...

FireCrack
14th Jun 2005, 06:56 PM
Hmm, that no health DM idea sounds very cool. For a mutator though, lotsa people would complain if you changed the gametype.

Vault
14th Jun 2005, 09:10 PM
Sorry but I must say that would be ****...

In a slow game like Halo whree you can take a break to get ur life back then carry on through SP mode... yeh that works.

Standing still in the middle of a DM match to regain your life is a ludicrus idea. "hang on let me just charge my health and you can line up the sniper rifle on my head......"

well you would recharge your health, thats the point, it would be a challenge, and it would recharge like really slow, it would be like 10 hp a sec or somthing, i mean this idea does suck, but its an alternative

Mr.Magnetichead
15th Jun 2005, 04:03 AM
And AIDS is an alternative to the common cold.

SirYawnalot
15th Jun 2005, 09:31 AM
UT had the 2k4 style armor system too... as well as the shield belt. What would you rather have - 2k3 style armor, 2k4 style armor, or both, like in the original ut?
Just to be totally different, I'd rather have the Unreal 1 system of having armour and shieldbelt totally seperate, so when you're out of shimmery stuff you've still got your carefully collected stash of armour left over.

I have a strong suspicion that I am rather tasteless, but still, lmao @ "And AIDS is an alternative to the common cold." ^_^

edhe
15th Jun 2005, 10:18 AM
Don't know if going back to UT style would be good or bad, having another pickup and armour setup could just make it more confusing for the newstarts.

-AEnubis-
15th Jun 2005, 01:45 PM
If the armor system has been toned down in every preveious game transition, why would one think they would beef it back up?

gregori
15th Jun 2005, 01:45 PM
Personally ,i hate the sound when you pick up the health,
it's just wrong,sounds much better when you pick up health in UT

the bases never really grew on me, they stick out and detract from alot of the maps,
i believe though that was because of map size. May be a mix of bases and realistic pick ups can be tried in ut2007, possible have the bases designed for the map they're in so they fit in. The visuals for the pickups are too ugly and gaudy at the moment.

Majik
15th Jun 2005, 01:49 PM
Health-generators were part of the original plan for UC/UT2k3.
AFAIK the idea was that the items would recharge slowly (thereby allowing you to choose between picking up part of the health or waiting) instead of the on/off-situation for current health- and ammo-packs.

Ah, how I miss the nali fruits. I thought they were a great and unique idea back then.

1337
15th Jun 2005, 01:54 PM
It's not right for someone with 1 life to pickup a 100 shield and be able to sustain 101 damage before dying. I like how the 50 and 100 are working right now. You can't pick up 2 50s to get 100 armor. This is a good thing. Because the 100 armor needs to be emphasized, as it is the most dangerous part to hold in most maps, while the 50 is usually surrounded with a beautiful garden of green vials and holographic images. I really enjoy the rythm and mapflow the 50 and 100 bring to ut2k4 tdm and 1v1. The shields only absorb 100% usually when you pickup up a 100 and another shield, while it only absorbs partially if you only grab one shield. If people really dislike the shield system they should complain to the mappers not putting in kegs instead of 100's and putting in more vials instead of 50a. I like the variety of different hp types. Health and Shield would be boring if they acted the same.