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Rupert_Holmes
30th Apr 2004, 05:35 PM
I’m looking for someone able to model cliffs and terrain for this classic map that is being ported to UT2k4
http://forums.beyondunreal.com/showthread.php?t=133556

chip
30th Apr 2004, 10:25 PM
i have a "shell" static mesh made directly from your BSP objects. it's now in MilkShape, and can be exported in a number of formats. it definitely needs cleanup & optimizing due to the conversion from BSP, but MilkShape isn't the best app for that, or for skinning it.

if you can find someone who can take my export from MilkShape, import it into Maya Complete, them save it as a Maya scene file, i could open it for editing in Maya PLE.

roundabout art path, but the mesh should fit like a glove.

Rupert_Holmes
30th Apr 2004, 11:00 PM
This may be helpful, check out the attached T3D MAXScript Tool and User Guide: By EALA Technical Art Director Kyle McKisic, for transferring level geometry to and from MAX.

chip
30th Apr 2004, 11:17 PM
don't have Max, only MilkShape & Maya PLE.

if you do some careful intersectioning on your subtracts, you can get a decent brush that can be made into an Add, then converted to StaticMesh. this is not an ideal process because BSP geometry is different from SM, and you don't have fully joined edges, and more vertices than probably necessary. but all this can be cleaned up if i can get the mesh into Maya PLE. the benefit is that the main edges and vertices are as close to 1:1 with the BSP as you're likely to get.

pretty sure a T3D translation would have similar issues since the brush geometry is still the original source of data.

chip
2nd May 2004, 10:14 AM
good news, R_H -- a post on another forum led me to a plugin that can bring the MilkShape model into PLE. it actually comes with Maya 5 PLE, but i just hadn't recognized it (it's labeled oddly).

so, shall i proceed?

Rupert_Holmes
2nd May 2004, 04:13 PM
Yes, I am Looking forward to seeing how it turns out :)

JonAzz
2nd May 2004, 08:23 PM
from that bsp layout I can't really teel what you need... do you jsut want some cliffs in the shape of what is there to be modeled? so there not as rigid.

I'll do something little like model that cli ff rim.

Rupert_Holmes
2nd May 2004, 09:29 PM
I need the cliffs and their tops modeled so they look more real, less UT99 blocky, and also the Ice cave with the stalagmites needs redone as well, the openings for the house tunnels and well top need to be provided for so they are not blocked by the mesh.

The first Alpha of the map is now available here

http://forums.beyondunreal.com/showthread.php?t=133556

Does the more complete Alpha level help show what is needed?

chip
3rd May 2004, 08:32 AM
I need the cliffs and their tops modeled so they look more real, less UT99 blocky, and also the Ice cave with the stalagmites needs redone as well, the openings for the house tunnels and well top need to be provided for so they are not blocked by the mesh.
hey, R_H, it really would have been good to know this up front, that you want something different than what your BSP outline shows. basically i've now wasted about 12 hours of modeling & skinning because you didn't describe what you really want.

to quote your intial post:
"I am looking for an experienced modeler who can make a quality mesh for the cliffs and ice cave, that has an identical footprint to the existing BSP brushes, so the mesh will fit into the map"

my model is a duplicate of your BSP, as initially asked for -- fit to the example provided.

i don't plan to go farther.

Rupert_Holmes
3rd May 2004, 10:57 AM
Chip, I think you are severely overreacting, if you have the BSP duplicated in Maya, you are more then halfway done, smooth the mesh and then check that the critical corners, the ones that are at ground level and intersect with building geometry don’t overlap beyond where they originally did, for example it would not look right if the fireplace in the house ended up covered by the new mesh.

That is why staying within the bounds of the original BSP was and still important.

I am interested in seeing what you claim to have done so far; please post a pic or a zip.

As for wasting time, you complain of wasting hours… I have devoted many days and nights to this project and I am not even halfway done.

Your lack of basic importing knowledge and subsequent whining over the time it takes, make you sound not only inexperienced but also like a total noob, the only way one ever learns is by many hours of actually doing.

chip
3rd May 2004, 11:28 AM
Your lack of basic importing knowledge and subsequent whining over the time it takes, make you sound not only inexperienced but also like a total noob, the only way one ever learns is by many hours of actually doing.this is how you expect to get help? you ask for an assist and then insult those who try to help -- no way, Ray.

if the project had been accurately described up front, i would have taken a significantly different approach to the model, but you asked for an exact footprint. i would have been more than willing to complete the model to that extent, then send it on to you for further embellishment if you can find someone else to do it. not any more.

as far as my capability, seems you're looking a gift horse in the mouth, never a friendly thing to do. so just take your own advice and spend a few hours learning to model & skin and make the damn thing yourself.

sheesh.

Rupert_Holmes
3rd May 2004, 01:43 PM
:rolleyes: I don’t see any horse at all, not even a pic of one, you have said lots but with nothing to show for it, JohnAzz on the other hand with just one post has shown more professionalism than you, he actually asked for clarification where he felt it necessary.

I am busy, what little free time I have I am devoting to this level, not holding the hand of a whiner and quitter.

I asked for someone able, and all you did was show you where not.

SolaceEternal
3rd May 2004, 02:19 PM
Can you import meshes from UT2k4 into milkshape? Just curious.

JonAzz
3rd May 2004, 02:59 PM
I'll make the cliffs and the ice cave, can i sort of rework the ice cave though? it seems to cylinder like. I'll make it move caveyer :P

just a question... the cliffs aroudn hte outside are made of rock right? well then if the cave you have going off to he side is ice then wouldn't it make more sense to have it so that its either all ice or all rock?
or how about making the area that goes into the ice cave ice and the rest rock? I can setup vertex shaders and vertex colour maps to do this, but i will need to set it up in the map itself.

In case you are wondering I have 3ds max, i am pretty much a noob in it but am progressing very nicely. modeling these simple things should be good practice for me :)


O and chip... no ofense or anything but I spent all of my free time for 2 weeks on a map (with custom models and textures) only to scrap it before it was done.
I know how it feels to waste your time on something only to redo it or scrap it. :/

Rupert_Holmes
3rd May 2004, 04:14 PM
Its tempting to alter the layout of the floor of the cave, if it where up to me, I would experiment with different layouts, however this map is for fanatical fans of the original, who expect a certain adherence to the originals floor plan and general ambiance.

I made the first Alpha a warm summer evening with fireflies, trees, and ferns, and although it looked nice, the fans said they wanted cold winter, and the original wind sounds back, so I am redoing the lighting, sounds, and skybox :D

There is a lot of room for visual improvement in the cave without changing the general floor layout, go crazy with the roof and stalagmite rock formations, and add some slight variation to the bottom of the underwater pool :D (these fans know the floor outline better then the back of their hands, and can strafe round that cave blindfolded, so as long as the floor outline and collision is the same, they will be happy)

I call it the “ice cave” because the floor is frozen water (and typing “The cave with the frozen floor” is a lot longer :D).

The cave walls, tunnel, and the cliffs are made out of rock.

Attached is a picture of the original cave, with its original texturing, it is tempting to make the cave entirely out of ice with a cool shader texture applied, unfortunately such a divergence from the original would just not fly with the fans. So it is best to make it out of rock.

Rupert_Holmes
3rd May 2004, 04:49 PM
Now that it is set for a winter only map, the cliff tops maybe could look something like the ones from BR-IceFields with the snow edging along them.

JonAzz
3rd May 2004, 06:29 PM
Now that it is set for a winter only map, the cliff tops maybe could look something like the ones from BR-IceFields with the snow edging along them.
was already planning on doing that :D


do you have AIM or MSN? I could talk this out more with you there :)

JonAzz
3rd May 2004, 07:19 PM
Are you planning on making this any bigger? the othere thread people where saying its to cramped and stuff and you said you are increaing it in size... let me know what you are doing about that so i can rescale the cliffs.

Rupert_Holmes
3rd May 2004, 10:14 PM
I rescaled the map adding .25 to its size (in the editor its “Scale map” by a factor of “1.25”) this fixed it and removed the overly cramped feeling, I will not be increasing the scale anymore as it now matches the original in proportion to the size of a character model.

I sent you a PM with a link to the rescaled level, the BPS will not be changing again, I promise. :)

One note, in the new alpha you will notice the cliff that forms the back wall of the house, it currently has snow on it, it would be nice to make the part inside the house use a different texture then the outdoor one, so this problem could be avoided with the mesh.

Sorry I don’t have instant messaging :(

JonAzz
4th May 2004, 06:18 PM
took about 4 hours but i got them done... its 4 seperate meshes, I am not very happy with how they turned out but they should do the trick, you will have to move some area of your level around in order for the cliffs to look right. and also there is no karma data on the cliffs, players will fall right through them when they die. you might want to use blocking volumes...

the cave is a little to small i think, if it is tell me I'll remodel it.
Its very difficult to make the rock/snow be jsut rock inside the house thing. it would require uneeded vertices and other stuff, not to mention getting it aligned would be a pain :rolleyes:

O i made all the meshes in there using one plane and just extruding and vertex editing :D

-Jon

check your PM's