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View Full Version : My only 'Real' complaint about UT2003


Radiosity
10th Jul 2003, 10:27 AM
The Ripper. Or lack thereof. Anyone have any idea why they decided to remove it? I love this weapon, it may not be that deadly compared to flak or whatever, but the fact you can headshot with it and that the blades bounce around for ages, not to mention that the secondary can push a target back quite a way too, makes it a very good weapon IMO. Plus, it was just fun launching tons of blades around the place :)

I remember I was quite annoyed when I first played the game and found no ripper :(

Other than the lack of the ripper though, I have no major complaints with UT2003 :D

TWD
10th Jul 2003, 10:50 AM
Try playing the game online with a modem or other crappy connection. The ripper will totally suck.

There is no "skill" in the ripper. Sure you could learn to shoot around the corners right and kill someone and there is that secondary fire. However, nobody used it like that. The secondary fire was NEVER used (besides you'd be better off using the rl for that kind of thing). All the ripper was used to do was shoot around blindly no skill just completely random spam in hopes you'd kill something. UT2003 was supposed to be about less spam and more skill. that's why the LG shoots less frequently, the flak bounces less, and the ripper is no more.

Besides as it's been said it'd be pretty much useless with the static meshes and such.

Radiosity
10th Jul 2003, 11:17 AM
Hmm, yeah I guess you're right TWD. I don't look at it as a spammy weapon because I play exclusively off-line and bots don't spam. But online.....yeah I see your point :)

What the hell, I'll just make myself a new and updated version of the model and code it myself :D

DaBeatard
10th Jul 2003, 11:20 AM
CSM, take a look around INA. I remember a while ago, someone began to make a model for it, but I don't know how far they got. You'll probably have to search for it because it was a couple of months ago (I think).

Orochi
10th Jul 2003, 11:22 AM
the ripper and static meshes prob wont work well together

Radiosity
10th Jul 2003, 11:22 AM
Thanks Beat, I'll have a look around :) Although....I've already got a pretty sweet idea of how it should look (anyone who's played Warhammer 40K Eldar will know the name 'Shuriken Cannon' *insert evil grin here*)

EDIT: Orochi got there before me :) Actually it does work, as I've coded a weapon that works like the ripper already.

Swift Viper
10th Jul 2003, 11:24 AM
Would it be easier to lower the number of bounces, like say to three or less? In UT, it bounced six times. Maybe the alt fire could be changed to stop it from being a mini rocket launcher too much. Slower rate of fire might also help, and maybe a bit more damage per blade. I don't understand how it could not work with Static Meshes, because the Flak bounces off ok, so why can't Ripper blades? Another reason why it might have been removed is maybe it did not have much use of what it could do over other weapons, besides bouncing around corners.

BTW, Chaos for UT2k3 will have the Ripper and is almost out, just a few more days.

Edit: Wow, a lot of people repiled before I finished my post and I saw them just now :lol: .

Swedix
10th Jul 2003, 11:41 AM
The secondary ripper was excelent to bounce people off ledges.
Face was an excelent map to use it on. Send the efc over the edge of the astroid :)

WebSlinger
10th Jul 2003, 11:53 AM
swedix said it before I could... that's what I used it for

DaBeatard
10th Jul 2003, 11:56 AM
http://www.ataricommunity.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=285688&highlight=ripper

I hope the ripper doesn't screw up the 'balance' of the weapons as it is now.


:)

Renegade Retard
10th Jul 2003, 12:09 PM
Just my opinion, but the sound effects of the ripper in Ut were the coolest. The sound of a blade wizzing by your head was wild!

Agreed with what Viper said. Why couldn't the ripper work? He mentioned the flak bouncing, but there's other items as well, such as grenades. They bounce all over the place with no problems. I'm not arguing the fact that it could be done, but rather simply asking because I don't know anything on the subject of static messes and so forth. I'm sure, though, that Epic had it's reasons for not putting it in the game.

BTW, just a thought - in regards to shooting the ripper around corners being "spammy" - what's the difference between that and using the shock combo to shot around corners? Again, just a thought from the mind of a Retarted fool. :p

DeDpoet|BuF
10th Jul 2003, 12:14 PM
i liked the spamminess of the ripper. used in moderation tho - say you're an FC, sending out a number of primary razors would usually hold guys back a little longer because of the potential hs and the lingering aspect (1 razor bouncing around 6x can suck up some good time). in dm or tdm, it was way too tempting to spam with it, hoping for a hs or random kill. It was impressive to see a skilled player score kills and hs's with the ripper (granted they weren't spamming). secondary was cool both with knocking opponents around and the fact that it was like an instafire rl.

edhe
10th Jul 2003, 01:11 PM
Try playing the game online with a modem or other crappy connection. The ripper will totally suck.

There is no "skill" in the ripper. Sure you could learn to shoot around the corners right and kill someone and there is that secondary fire. However, nobody used it like that. The secondary fire was NEVER used (besides you'd be better off using the rl for that kind of thing). All the ripper was used to do was shoot around blindly no skill just completely random spam in hopes you'd kill something. UT2003 was supposed to be about less spam and more skill. that's why the LG shoots less frequently, the flak bounces less, and the ripper is no more.

Besides as it's been said it'd be pretty much useless with the static meshes and such.
3 second delay headshot up the hill on face, i'd call that skill.

But yes, it was mainly a spam weapon and yes, the inclusion of static meshes would kinda screw things up with it and yes it's secondary was useful and fun and yes it could've been re-adapted into a new weapon but no, it wasn't.

CrazyCougar
10th Jul 2003, 01:16 PM
The ripper was underappreciated. The secondary fire was deadly in the hands of someone who knew how to use it. Same with the primary you didn't need to spam it to get kills. I used to get some really nice headshots with it. I rarely had to fire more than 3 blades to kill someone. Plus, you had to know how to fire it without suiciding. If they didn't bring it into ut2003 because of the spam then they should have nerfed it like everything else. Give it a burst mode. Fire 5 blades and it reloads, so if you held down the fire button it would only shoot out a limited number of blades.

It would have been nice if they had left it in. :)

Radiosity
10th Jul 2003, 01:32 PM
As I said above, there are no problems with a weapon like that and meshes. I've coded a weapon that fires blades and they bounce around quite happily :) No it's not the ripper either, it's another weapon entirely (does use the sounds though).

Swift Viper
10th Jul 2003, 02:24 PM
ChainsawMonkey, is that going to be in the weapons pack your making or something else? I want a blade shooting weapon or at least an "around-the-corner" weapon. Renegade Retard did have a point, is using the combo to shoot around corners just as bad? Is there any possible way to make a spam-free (or as spamless as possible) around the corner weapon that is useful and still takes skills? I gotten better at pulling off Ripper head shots laterly. As CrazyCougar said, you have to be able to shoot it without killing yourself first. I saw a lot more Flak Cannon bashing then Ripper bashing and yet the weapons get lowed in spam, but the Ripper is removed all together. Come to think of it, you will get called a lamer no what weapon you kill with, I got flamed for using Pulse Gun and Flak Cannon in Rocket Arena, yet the admin did not remove the weapon(s), lame. Anyone have anymore ideas to lower spam and not make the weapon useless? The reloading idea might work or maybe just a slower rate of fire to keep it unreal if you know what I mean.

Radiosity
10th Jul 2003, 02:54 PM
Yes it is in that weapon pack. It's pretty powerful too, but then so are all the weapons :)

Sir_Brizz
10th Jul 2003, 10:34 PM
It wouldn't bounce off the meshes themselves, it bounces off it's collision box which is alot more straight then most static meshes.

BigFolks
10th Jul 2003, 11:28 PM
that depends though. I think some noobs misuse static meshes, make their own maps with their own static meshes that have like 50+ corners to it and then the blade flak grenade guns would all be ****ed.

I must say THE RIPPER IS NOT A NOOB WEAPON!! It's quite skillful. I used it alot and got many a kills with it

hal
11th Jul 2003, 01:19 AM
I did always love the Ripper, and I never managed to get killed so much with it that I got annoyed by it. Some of the other people in this thread have pretty much summed up my thoughts on it.

-Underappreciated
-Using it skillfully is a blast
-Secondary rocks
-Great surprise Face weapon
-Headshot!

Metakill
11th Jul 2003, 01:29 AM
Ripper was my favorite weapon. Not the one I made the most kills with, just the one I had the most fun with. It was the most satisfying weapon to kill with, especially a trick-shot headshot. It's my only real complaint about UT][ too. I am looking forward to the new Chaos.

A_Rimmerlister
11th Jul 2003, 05:49 AM
They could have done the same to those bouncing blades as they did with with the flak : just one or two bounces instead of infinite.
It's definitely an underrated signature weapon of the Unreal-series.

ChaosUT for UT'03 will have a ripper-like weapon, so all may be well again ... :)

The shrieker-cannon (or shuriken-cannon & it's smaller cousin the shuriken-catapult) where great ideas in Wh40k ... especially the variants that shot some kind of weird infecting ammo (IIRC the harlequin-army used those) ... to see these guns in UT'03 would be great *hint* *hint* ;)

Radiosity
11th Jul 2003, 06:16 AM
Damn! I've done it again haven't I? Gonna have to make a Warhammer themed weapon pack now aren't I :lol:

I'm glad it's not just me who misses the ripper :)
@ Brizz - yeah, they work great as long as there's good collision on the mesh.
@ Rimmer - that's what I did with my weapon, gave it a random number of bounces between 1 and 4.

Sir_Brizz
11th Jul 2003, 09:34 PM
well yah after that it is the mappers idiocy that ruins the weapons....even ruins the flak in certain situations.

A_Rimmerlister
12th Jul 2003, 09:35 AM
Damn! I've done it again haven't I? Gonna have to make a Warhammer themed weapon pack now aren't I :lol:

@ Rimmerlister - that's what I did with my weapon, gave it a random number of bounces between 1 and 4.

*ooh* yesss make one please :)
Wishlist :
- Shuriken Catapult
- Shuriken Cannon
- Meltagun
- Lasgun
- Lascannon
- Plasmapistol & it's bigger brothers ...

Too bad that you'd need to get permission from GW first.

ZenPirate
12th Jul 2003, 10:44 AM
The ripper was my fav weapon, right after the sniper rifle. Maybe UT2004 will have it back

Radiosity
12th Jul 2003, 07:16 PM
All those weapons would be easy enough :) And probably the bolter as the bog-standard AR replacement (I don't much like the Imperium, I'm an Eldar man - meaning the second edition Eldar that still kicked ass before GW nerfed them in 3rd edition :( ).

I used to keep in contact with one of the guys at GW head office Nottingham :) Dunno if he still works there now though, but it's worth a try.